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MTG Commander/Elder Dragon Highlander • View topic - Sundering Titan

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 Post subject: Sundering Titan
AgePosted: 2012-Jun-20 4:36 am 

Joined: 2009-Dec-27 2:26 pm
Age: Wyvern


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 Post subject: Re: Sundering Titan
AgePosted: 2012-Jun-20 4:50 am 

Joined: 2008-Sep-21 11:51 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Not going to miss sundering titan at all.


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 Post subject: Re: Sundering Titan
AgePosted: 2012-Jun-20 4:59 am 

Joined: 2009-Dec-27 2:26 pm
Age: Wyvern


Last edited by ddt15 on 2012-Jun-22 6:43 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Sundering Titan
AgePosted: 2012-Jun-20 5:18 am 

Joined: 2008-Sep-09 9:54 am
Age: Dragon
Location: New England
While I'm not nearly as upset as the OP, I will admit that I'm scratching my head a little on this one. I'm not particularly disappointed, because ST isn't the most enjoyable card to play with in the world, but was anyone really rallying to get this one nixed currently? "A fair amount of community distaste" sure seems to indicate just that, and I haven't seen much talk at all on this guy lately.

Heck, everyone around here just stopped playing it a long time ago. It's a non-issue.

Sheldon/Ban Ki and crew, any real-world insight on this one? Seems kind of out of left field, considering all of the other stuff that has been a bit more publically talked about.

Kind of surprised nothing was un-banned too...

--->DJ

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Co-Author, Dear Azami - StarCityGames.com


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 Post subject: Re: Sundering Titan
AgePosted: 2012-Jun-20 5:26 am 

Joined: 2009-Mar-31 4:25 pm
Age: Drake
It really shows they have no idea what they're doing. Nothing in recent magic changed how sundering titan was played, has been for 8 years, and there hasn't be any sort of recent uproar about it either. It's a very glaring mistake either way on their part, they aren't giving the list proper attention.


Also, I don't think there's much that's broken about cards you can say "Didn't use, didn't need" for turns on end. I mean if koko's supposed to be back breaking and warping then why did you have infy better options?


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 Post subject: Re: Sundering Titan
AgePosted: 2012-Jun-20 5:26 am 
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Joined: 2012-Feb-07 4:15 pm
Age: Elder Dragon


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 Post subject: Re: Sundering Titan
AgePosted: 2012-Jun-20 5:50 am 
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Joined: 2012-Apr-01 1:06 pm
Age: Drake

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If you can't kill it with a counterspell or a wrath, it might be just a bit broken


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 Post subject: Re: Sundering Titan
AgePosted: 2012-Jun-20 5:55 am 
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Joined: 2010-Mar-12 3:20 pm
Age: Elder Dragon

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Current Commander Decks:
Alesha, She who Smiles at Death.....Atraxa, Praetors' Voice.....Eight-and-a-Half-Tails.....Gonti, Lord of Luxury.....Karametra, God of Harvests.....Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker.....Kozilek, the Great Distortion.....Prime Speaker Zegana.....Rubinia Soulsinger.....Thrasios, Triton Hero + Vial Smasher the Fierce

My general commander philosophy: Using your opponent's degenerate cards against them is far more satisfying than playing degenerate cards yourself.


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 Post subject: Re: Sundering Titan
AgePosted: 2012-Jun-20 7:02 am 
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Joined: 2008-May-04 6:05 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Wisconsin
Just thought I'd offer some thoughts...

First off, I play a 5-color deck with 10x Duals, 4x Forest Shocks, and 5x Basic lands as the main mana producers. Sundering Titan (ST) WRECKS my deck so hard it isn't even funny. That being said, I think it's an absolutely fair strategy to keep my deck in check. No, a properly timed Wasteland, Strip Mine, etc. is not going to hose my deck. Honestly, if someone would waste a Waste (haha that's funny) on my Tropical Island instead of a Cabal Coffers, I'd be super disappointed.

As some have said above, I also find this banning contradictory. I'm not saying ST shouldn't be banned, but I think Primeval Titan (PT) is a far better choice. Sure it kills basics. Sure it kills them on the way in and out. Yet, quite frankly, I'd rather see a ST kill some lands, than someone fetching out Cabal Coffers and Urborg. Plus, ST is really swingy; some games it might be a house, other games it's only going to effect a single player. I'd rather just play Kozilek because I know I'm going to be drawing 4 cards and that's simply more powerful than blowing up some random basics. Hell if I get to attack with Kozilek, I'll probably blow up some lands anyways. The point is, typically, there are better card choices that ST which is why it's not played as often and, IMHO, a non-issue.

I mean if you really listen to the community, when was the last time people compared anything to ST? I'm pretty sure PT is the go to card for "top of the line" power. Why ban a card that is widely believed less problematic?


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 Post subject: Re: Sundering Titan
AgePosted: 2012-Jun-20 7:15 am 

Joined: 2011-May-16 2:43 am
Age: Wyvern
Whiners/Idiots: 1
good Players: 0

Sundering Titan was never(!) a problem. These guys who are playing 5c should know that it is a bit more risky. If the Sundering Titan is used to kick out a single player, the others will ignore the screwed player because he would not be a threat at all. But the player who played the Sundering Titan will be in the focused by each enemy.

The Sundering Titen does not create "undesireable" game states except you think that Landdestruction is "undesireable"... and thats absolutely stupid!

The Primeval Titan and the Consectrated Sphinx are much more dangerous because both cards will change the game totally after they entered the battlefield. Most games ended a few turns after these Cards were used/copied/blinked/... but the Sundering Titan did never(!) such things.

Im playing the Sundering Titan in all of my decks because he is the perfect answer for these 3-5c Goodstuff noobs, to slow them down, to prevent them from playing their "i win the game" cards to early and 3-5c Goodstuff Decks got many(!) of these stupid cards. Most "i win the game" cards cost less or equal to the Sundering Titan, but the Sundering Titan does not win any game! Hes just slowing down noobs.

The most important fact: The Sundering Titan is not able to blow up a whole multiplayer match. Maybe it is possible to screw a single player of the group and then? Seems to be Stupid for me. A 8 Mana card should be able to do unfair things. Ban Terastoton and Woodfall primus two plz.

Mikaeus the unhallowed + Woodfall Primus + Phyrexian altar = "destroy all permaments" and XXX Mana...

Griselbrand should be available as a normal card in decks too, because a single Tooth and Nail will result in many different instant wins (Triskelion+Mikaeus for example).


So what now? Banning each card if enough idiots are crying for its ban?
Each idiot enjoys creating 30+ mana by abusing the primeval titan.
But the same idiot is crying for his/her mommy if the Sundering Titan is used to prevent this.




Stupid shit!

_________________
Problems with same commanders in EDH?
Use this:
Commanders do not eliminate other commanders by legendary rule.
Non commander permanents are still able to eliminate commanders by legendary rule.


Last edited by maSu on 2012-Jun-20 7:29 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Sundering Titan
AgePosted: 2012-Jun-20 7:23 am 
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Joined: 2011-Mar-15 12:45 am
Age: Elder Dragon
I don't like seeing this kind of vitriol directed at the RC, who are much better and more experienced players than I am (and probably most of you as well).

That said, I find the banning of Sundering Titan puzzling at best, and if I'd heard there was a titan on the banned list, I'd have assumed Prime Time and been fine with it.


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 Post subject: Re: Sundering Titan
AgePosted: 2012-Jun-20 7:51 am 

Joined: 2008-Sep-09 9:54 am
Age: Dragon
Location: New England
You're right. It absolutely doesn't deserve the anger that it seems to be creating towards the RC. But I do think it'd be great to get a bit of a detailed explanation or play results or something from them to explain why this card got hit *right now*. Especially since it doesn't seem to be on anyone's radar, and also because it seems to break from the mold a bit as far as criteria is concerned. (As far as I can tell, "creates unfun gamestates" was never a prime criteria for banning, nor was "People have been complaining about it.")

Interesting that the responses to Sheldon's SCG article seem to mirror the "Where did this come from?" sentiment. (Well, that, and a surprising number of people who somehow are of the opinion that Griselbrand shouldn't have gotten banhammered. Can't figure that out...)

--->DJ

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General Damage Control - Magic: The Gathering. Elder Dragon Highlander/Commander. No Pulled Punches.

Co-Author, Dear Azami - StarCityGames.com


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 Post subject: Re: Sundering Titan
AgePosted: 2012-Jun-20 8:04 am 
EDH Rules Committee
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Joined: 2006-May-24 10:14 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Tampa, FL, USA
The short answer is "it was past time." I spend a great deal of time talking to a large number of people about the format during both my travels to events and online, and it routinely comes up as a card that the social player finds miserable. Over the last year, I've noticed a marked increase in it coming up (unsolicited, btw), which meant it was time to have the RC talk about it again.

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 Post subject: Re: Sundering Titan
AgePosted: 2012-Jun-20 8:20 am 

Joined: 2012-Apr-11 7:17 am
Age: Elder Dragon


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 Post subject: Re: Sundering Titan
AgePosted: 2012-Jun-20 8:21 am 
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Joined: 2008-Mar-24 12:14 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Oakland, CA


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