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MTG Commander/Elder Dragon Highlander • View topic - let's talk unbanning.

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 Post subject: Re: let's talk unbanning.
AgePosted: 2019-May-19 3:46 pm 
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Joined: 2010-Jul-18 9:59 pm
Age: Elder Dragon

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"Degenerate, unfun decks generally come from degenerate, unfun players in my experience." - Cthulus Thrall

"- if this spell is played ten times in a given game then I suggest you warm up the tar and pluck some chickens" - tarnar

The internet's great at making noise, and poor at operating pants. There's gonna be half-dressed mobs screeching half-assed arguments for the rest of the 21st century - Kemev


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 Post subject: Re: let's talk unbanning.
AgePosted: 2019-May-20 1:35 pm 

Joined: 2012-Apr-11 7:17 am
Age: Elder Dragon


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 Post subject: Re: let's talk unbanning.
AgePosted: 2019-May-20 1:49 pm 
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Joined: 2009-Aug-20 7:49 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: New Hampshire

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"The President's job - and if someone sufficiently vain and stupid is picked he won't realize this - is not to wield power, but to draw attention away from it." -- Douglas Adams, predicting the future.


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 Post subject: Re: let's talk unbanning.
AgePosted: 2019-May-20 3:58 pm 

Joined: 2014-Jul-26 11:35 am
Age: Elder Dragon

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 Post subject: Re: let's talk unbanning.
AgePosted: 2019-May-20 11:21 pm 

Joined: 2015-Sep-02 2:49 am
Age: Drake
Location: Connecticut
I wouldn't object to a rather extensive unbanning. Since that's not how it works, you've got to make compelling arguments for the current least offenders. Recurring Nightmare would get you more discussion than Braids.


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 Post subject: Re: let's talk unbanning.
AgePosted: 2019-May-21 1:02 am 
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Joined: 2011-Jan-02 5:25 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Costa La Haya, capital del ducado Holanda

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 Post subject: Re: let's talk unbanning.
AgePosted: 2019-May-21 1:45 am 

Joined: 2019-Apr-29 9:42 pm
Age: Drake
So I’m all for unbanning cards in the format. I don’t like how it feels like the RC wants to make the format as wide as possible for newer players in the community by protecting them from ‘unfun cards’.

On the other hand I don’t see how braids benefits the format. Cards that are more comparable that are not banned are nine deathmantle to reoccuring nightmare or seedborn muse to prophet of kruphix. These cards are at least comparable to one another, but I didn’t see a good example of that from braids. Have you tested it out in your own group? Have your tried to play her as your general on turn two with a token generator? How much fun vs toxicity is she providing to the game? These are the questions you need to answer before jumping the gun and saying something should or shouldn’t be banned.

On the other hand my group unbanned Geiselbrand and reoccuring nightmare. We don’t play sol ring or infinite combos so those cards are fine and easily played around.

People have a problem with seedborn muse and purphoros. Mostly in multi colored decks..

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 Post subject: Re: let's talk unbanning.
AgePosted: 2019-May-21 5:43 am 
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Joined: 2013-Oct-26 9:21 am
Age: Dragon
Location: Xenia, OH, USA
Hi there RonB, and welcome to Commander... A few things... Firstly:

"Commander is designed to promote social games of magic.
It is played in a variety of ways, depending on player preference, but a common vision ties together the global community to help them enjoy a different kind of magic. That vision is predicated on a social contract: an agreement which goes beyond these rules to includes a degree of interactivity between players. Players should aim to interact both during the game and before it begins, discussing with other players what they expect/want from the game."

The main reason people bristle at Braids is because it violates the highlighted area in an almost violent way.

Braids leads to incredibly uninteractive, one sided games.

Commander is not and should not be played as Vintage Singleton. It is designed as a format to have fun, make sure everyone has fun, and play some wacky cards.

Secondly, I highly recommend reading this post by Sheldon:

http://forum.mtgcommander.net/EDH_Forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=12254

as it gives great detail as to why things get and stay banned. Very few cards once on the list, get removed from the list. For good reason.

Lastly, remember, just because it is fun for you, does not mean it is fun for everyone. If all you do is suck the fun out of the game for other players, you will rapidly find yourself without people to play with.

TLDR: Braids (and other lockout/annoying strategies like that) are masturbating with cardboard. No one should be forced to sit there and watch you do it.


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 Post subject: Re: let's talk unbanning.
AgePosted: 2019-May-21 9:06 am 
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Joined: 2010-Jul-18 9:59 pm
Age: Elder Dragon

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"Degenerate, unfun decks generally come from degenerate, unfun players in my experience." - Cthulus Thrall

"- if this spell is played ten times in a given game then I suggest you warm up the tar and pluck some chickens" - tarnar

The internet's great at making noise, and poor at operating pants. There's gonna be half-dressed mobs screeching half-assed arguments for the rest of the 21st century - Kemev


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 Post subject: Re: let's talk unbanning.
AgePosted: 2019-May-21 10:17 am 
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Joined: 2009-Aug-20 7:49 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: New Hampshire

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"The President's job - and if someone sufficiently vain and stupid is picked he won't realize this - is not to wield power, but to draw attention away from it." -- Douglas Adams, predicting the future.


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 Post subject: Re: let's talk unbanning.
AgePosted: 2019-May-23 9:32 am 

Joined: 2014-Jul-26 11:35 am
Age: Elder Dragon

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 Post subject: Re: let's talk unbanning.
AgePosted: 2019-May-25 1:54 am 

Joined: 2015-Dec-22 4:41 am
Age: Drake

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 Post subject: Re: let's talk unbanning.
AgePosted: 2019-May-27 10:06 am 

Joined: 2014-Jul-26 11:35 am
Age: Elder Dragon
You are assuming that an objective decision cannot be made based on subjective data. You can take a concept like fun, apply it across a wide spectrum of people and then make a decision based on what the average response is. I find this to be unfun is not the same as most people find this unfun. We assume the RC makes their decisions based on the feelings of many, not the feelings of few.

Being whipped can be considered objectively unpleasant and we can argue that you should not be allowed to whip someone without their explicit permission, despite the existence of people that specifically enjoy it.

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 Post subject: Re: let's talk unbanning.
AgePosted: 2019-May-27 10:56 am 

Joined: 2014-Sep-13 7:28 am
Age: Elder Dragon


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 Post subject: Re: let's talk unbanning.
AgePosted: 2019-May-28 8:47 am 
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Joined: 2009-Aug-20 7:49 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: New Hampshire

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"The President's job - and if someone sufficiently vain and stupid is picked he won't realize this - is not to wield power, but to draw attention away from it." -- Douglas Adams, predicting the future.


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