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MTG Commander/Elder Dragon Highlander • View topic - [1:N, Mayael] Dear Mayael...

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 Post subject: Re: [1:N, Mayael] Dear Mayael...
AgePosted: 2016-Apr-25 10:07 am 
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Joined: 2007-Mar-28 12:38 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Omaha
I use both and (and !) as far as 's best friends go.. I came to the same conclusion as pi as far as , though...I'd rather spend that 6 mana using Mayael again next turn.

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 Post subject: Re: [1:N, Mayael] Dear Mayael...
AgePosted: 2016-May-23 1:27 am 

Joined: 2010-Apr-16 6:59 am
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Location: Freemont, NE (Omaha area) USA
After reading the last few pages of (GREAT!) suggestions, I dug out my old Mayael deck and took it from beast to dragon tribal. FUN! One card I just had to add, that I don't see a mention of here is . Really helps when my hand starts to fill with big creatures. If it is listed earlier in this thread, my apologies. I didn't go back and read the whole thing!

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 Post subject: Re: [1:N, Mayael] Dear Mayael...
AgePosted: 2016-May-23 9:06 am 
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Joined: 2011-Feb-19 12:15 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Sacramento, CA
I took out for which I later took out for .

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 Post subject: Re: [1:N, Mayael] Dear Mayael...
AgePosted: 2016-May-24 1:27 am 
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Location: Amsterdam, Holland
's weakness is that it falls over in a light breeze while making you wait a turn before you can even use it. doesn't have those problems, though it's less castable. I tend to survive to the late game based on whatever is cheap enough to cast and mass removal, mostly the latter. The Piper just won't survive for all that long and what it puts into play wouldn't either and that's just based on what I do myself. I reckon at most I'll get 2 activations out of it in a game and those activations will bring me something good, but, come at card parity rather than card advantage when it comes to comparing the Piper to Mayael. I much rather be activating Mayael or the Myojin even if they may be a bit harder to get going, I should have enough time anyway.

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 Post subject: Re: [1:N, Mayael] Dear Mayael...
AgePosted: 2016-May-29 8:14 am 

Joined: 2010-Apr-16 6:59 am
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Location: Freemont, NE (Omaha area) USA
I'm also getting great action out of the - combo.

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 Post subject: Re: [1:N, Mayael] Dear Mayael...
AgePosted: 2016-May-29 5:47 pm 
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Joined: 2011-Jan-02 5:25 am
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Location: Costa La Haya, capital del ducado Holanda
As a backup for Mayael I'd sooner run a noncreature solution like Summoning Trap. When your Mayael doesn't work because you can't keep her on the board, you can't keep Elvish Piper on the board either. Now that tuck isn't a thing, I'm less inclined to go for backups for your general.

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 Post subject: Re: [1:N, Mayael] Dear Mayael...
AgePosted: 2016-May-29 7:39 pm 
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Location: Amsterdam, Holland
Yeah, Wurm and Avacyn have pretty good synergy. Wurm tends to be a little unreliable as far as Wraths go though, so it's right on the edge of making it in or dropping out of the deck, but you accomplish the same with traditional Wraths.

I've chosen , and as my backup plans, would be far from bad, but I don't usually have an issue between Mayael and these, some search and just naturally casting fatties. I tend to play more mass removal than anybody else at the table, so my Mayael tends not to stick around for too long anyway (but a few turns is more than enough). I guess that in my regular group people felt there was enough mass removal so they didn't play as much in their decks, meaning I would more often be in control of when the next mass removal would hit than they would be.

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 Post subject: Re: [1:N, Mayael] Dear Mayael...
AgePosted: 2016-May-29 7:39 pm 
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Yeah, Wurm and Avacyn have pretty good synergy. Wurm tends to be a little unreliable as far as Wraths go though, so it's right on the edge of making it in or dropping out of the deck, but you accomplish the same with traditional Wraths.

I've chosen , and as my backup plans, would be far from bad, but I don't usually have an issue between Mayael and these, some search and just naturally casting fatties. I tend to play more mass removal than anybody else at the table, so my Mayael tends not to stick around for too long anyway (but a few turns is more than enough). I guess that in my regular group people felt there was enough mass removal so they didn't play as much in their decks, meaning I would more often be in control of when the next mass removal would hit than they would be.

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 Post subject: Re: [1:N, Mayael] Dear Mayael...
AgePosted: 2016-Jun-17 7:27 am 
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Joined: 2007-Mar-28 12:38 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Omaha
found its way out of my deck, and I was having about as much synergy with it as I could (, , , (a stretch)).

As far as Mayael backup plans go, I try to have things that wouldn't die to the same removal. Quicksilver Amulet is an idea I've toyed with, but currently I'm playing , , , and . I want to try and fit in , just because I've always loved that card, but it's bad, right?

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 Post subject: Re: [1:N, Mayael] Dear Mayael...
AgePosted: 2016-Jun-18 10:15 pm 
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Joined: 2012-Nov-27 4:39 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Midgard
I suppose is possibly another back-up plan for Mayael decks. I've seen the card in action, and it's pretty good.


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 Post subject: Re: [1:N, Mayael] Dear Mayael...
AgePosted: 2016-Jun-20 7:06 pm 
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Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Amsterdam, Holland

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 Post subject: Re: [1:N, Mayael] Dear Mayael...
AgePosted: 2016-Jun-24 7:13 am 
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Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Omaha
RE:

That's a pretty fair point- - (alone) is certainly a card disadvantage engine, and at 30% chance, there's not a lot of room to spare. When you're looking at 40%, though, it becomes a bit more appealing. Put good sneak attack critters into your hand, good "on the battlefield for good" critters in your library.

But the built-in synergy with what your creatures actually do in a deck like this is what makes it break-even or better. Using it with it's a break-even. Using it with is a 3-for-none. (4-for-none if you use it when an opponent attacks you.) Using it with things like or give you extra flexibility. At that point, it sort of becomes a rattlesnake. No one wants to attack into the unknown (in the same way opponents typically don't want to attack into an untapped Mayael, but can be a significantly bigger blowout). If you've got (WAT!) or out, the blowout factor becomes a blowout factorial.

And, a super minor point, but one that was very relevant in my last game. It's less color-intensive than Mayael.



tl;dr While it's technically a card-disadvantage machine, in my opinion the cards in my deck and their natural synergy typically make the disadvantage worth it for flexibility reasons. The rest of the deck is a ridiculous card advantage machine (for nonblack, nonblue decks).

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 Post subject: Re: [1:N, Mayael] Dear Mayael...
AgePosted: 2016-Jun-27 7:22 pm 
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Joined: 2008-Dec-26 7:50 am
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Location: Amsterdam, Holland
How would you define "good sneak attack critters"? You give a few examples later, but to me those are better on the Battlefield than in my Yard. True, I couldn't rush out a bunch of them all of a sudden, but only when an opponent has suddenly amassed an army of their own would that be a problem. Normally if their armies outclass my ability to keep them at bay I will play mass removal (of course I will not always have that, but I do play quite a bit of it and in that case other players will also be highly motivated to do the same), if they don't then a Mayael activation is usually enough of a rattlesnake to make them go elsewhere. To me the creature disappearing afterwards is far more of a problem than the things Sneak Attack would help me against as they just don't happen very frequently. The benefits it provides are nice, but, they also tend to be overkill. It's been rare for my opponents to be able to deal with my deck when it truly gets going. I will kill off those more likely to have mass removal first and in 2-3 turns it should be done anyway where Sneak Attack might make it 1-2 turns instead.

If your deck is more focused on quickly taking out opponents (AKA the aggro I mentioned) the card makes much more sense, mine is geared in a more controlish fashion and I'll want every little bit of card advantage I can get so that I can end up being the player with considerable resources when the other players have ran out of them. I'll be happy to grant you that the card makes sense in your deck, but that doesn't necessary mean it makes sense for other Mayael decks. It's certainly a valid card to consider depending on your strategy for winning a game.

I realize that my approach relies a lot on correctly identifying what my opponents will do, giving them the right impression of what my deck could do and building the deck in such a way that it supports my ability to make those things happen regularly. I find that I rely a lot on setting up an image in their minds and I play to support that image. My opponents probably give me and my decks more credit than would be wise. I find that sometimes I can even reap the rewards of that in other games (non-Magic). I'm also pretty decent at mind games, sometimes letting me get away with things I really shouldn't be getting away with. I guess in a sense I am a rattlesnake myself ;).

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 Post subject: Re: [1:N, Mayael] Dear Mayael...
AgePosted: 2016-Jun-27 11:59 pm 
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Joined: 2012-Jan-06 10:25 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Seattle

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 Post subject: Re: [1:N, Mayael] Dear Mayael...
AgePosted: 2016-Jun-30 5:33 am 
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Joined: 2011-Jan-02 5:25 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Costa La Haya, capital del ducado Holanda
Sneak Attack is awesome, but it requires a deck around it.

Either have a plan to recur the dead creatures, play creatures you want dead in the first place, blink, or bounce. Sneak Attack allows you to cheat on mana cost, but you already have that option in a Mayael deck. Redundancy is nice, but to break Sneak Attack you need other cards, and then you need redundancy for those cards, and then you figure out you don't have redundancy for Sneak Attack itself (because there is not a proper substitute).

In a different deck, you don't have Mayael, so you don't already have the ability to cheat stuff into play. So if your deck can blink (Eldrazi Displacer is all the rage now) or bounce, then look for Sneak Attack. Ulasht or Marath with Cloudstone Curio around, that's a nice setup where you can take full advantage of Sneak. If your deck is not that deck, a draw engine is probably getting you to places Sneak Attack isn't bringing you.

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