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 Post subject: Drawing to Death
AgePosted: 2012-Jul-06 10:18 am 
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Joined: 2011-May-04 9:09 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Saskatchewan
This came up a little while ago and I just remembered it now.

Mass X Draw spell is used. Player A has 10 card in their library, Player B has 15, Player C has 20 and Player D has 25 (easy numbers for math examples).

Obviously, if I made everyone draw 21 cards, Player D wins, but is it a draw if everyone has to draw 30 cards when the spell finishes resolving? Or do people lose as they become unable to draw a card and then lose in the order of who has the least cards?


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 Post subject: Re: Drawing to Death
AgePosted: 2012-Jul-06 10:21 am 
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Joined: 2006-May-24 10:14 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Tampa, FL, USA
It's a draw because State-Based Actions aren't checked until a player would get priority, which is after the spell has resolved.

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 Post subject: Re: Drawing to Death
AgePosted: 2012-Jul-06 10:56 am 
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Joined: 2011-May-04 9:09 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Saskatchewan
Glad I erred on the side of caution, then. A Minds Aglow got a little out of hand when the Teferi player cast High Tide just to spite me.

So, the second part of the question, is this. I have Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind in play and enough cards left in the deck to kill the rest of the players. When does this damage occur?


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 Post subject: Re: Drawing to Death
AgePosted: 2012-Jul-06 11:20 am 
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Joined: 2007-Jan-05 12:58 am
Age: Elder Dragon
When Niv is in play and you draw cards, a separate trigger is stacked for each card you drew. So, if you cast Brainstorm, you'd draw 3 cards, put 2 back, and once it's done resolving you'd stack 3 pings and target whatever. If you had fewer than 3 cards left in your library, though, you'd die during the SBE check and never stack the triggers.


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 Post subject: Re: Drawing to Death
AgePosted: 2012-Jul-06 2:57 pm 
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Joined: 2011-May-04 9:09 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Saskatchewan
Thank you. That clears that up for me completely, I hope.


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 Post subject: Re: Drawing to Death
AgePosted: 2012-Jul-07 1:07 am 
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Joined: 2009-Feb-11 7:00 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
On a slightly related subject, (milling) say i cause my opponent to mill the top 10 cards of said library and he only has 6, does he lose that turn as he no longer has cards to mill or would he have to wait till the next draw "trigger"?

I use the term trigger as it may be a played card or a standard draw step that could finish him off.

I am right in thinking that if I mill more then your library you have to wait till that player draws a card to make it an official loss, as milling is not a card drawing ability.

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 Post subject: Re: Drawing to Death
AgePosted: 2012-Jul-07 1:52 am 

Joined: 2008-Sep-21 11:51 am
Age: Elder Dragon
you need to force a draw, or let a draw happen for them to lose the game.


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 Post subject: Re: Drawing to Death
AgePosted: 2012-Jul-07 3:18 am 
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Joined: 2009-Feb-11 7:00 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
So would platinum angel keep you alive? You can't lose so I assume yes

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 Post subject: Re: Drawing to Death
AgePosted: 2012-Jul-07 8:25 am 
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Joined: 2011-Aug-13 2:49 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
thedarkheart wrote:
So would platinum angel keep you alive? You can't lose so I assume yes

"You can't lose the game" means exactly what it says. :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Drawing to Death
AgePosted: 2012-Jul-09 4:51 am 

Joined: 2011-Sep-30 6:08 am
Age: Elder Dragon
At the M13 prerelease this weekend I chumped with a Vedalken Entrancer because I had a Jace and I thought my opponent had 13 cards left in his deck. Turns out he had 12. :facepalm:

I won anyway because my opponent didn't draw a way to win, but man was that embarrassing.

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