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 Post subject: Re: Forum Game: I Need A Hero!
AgePosted: 2018-Nov-19 6:02 am 
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Joined: 2012-Dec-03 3:16 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Sinis wrote:
Sid the Chicken wrote:
I'd like to forget basically every time something like Sire, or Vorinclex, or Iona hits the table.

(not an answer)

I mean, I'm still baffled how you can even consider Sire in the same category of Vorinclex or Iona. The other two usually prevent you from playing half your cards. All Sire does is randomly exile stuff from your deck (you're not playing combo, are you?) and draw me cards. At 6 mana is Sire as bad a NPE as Primeval Titan was? How does it compare to DEN? Prophet of Kruphix?

I'm genuinely curious; I'll be honest, I just don't see it. Even if someone randomly exiles 10 cards from my deck, all (and I mean ALL) of my decks would still function (and would likely not notice the difference).


I think it is appropriate to lump Sire into the same group as Iona, Vorinclex, Black Braids etc. because it makes you not want to play the game. I do rarely play combo but regardless when I have seen Sire hit the field it either immediately eats removal or it changes the pace of the game. I would say it is almost as format warping as Primeval titan, except it is 2 colors and doesn't have an EtB ability. I would rather see DEN as you at least have to commit resources to DEN to do the thing. Granted if you have unlimited mana it doesn't matter much as the game is over. Maybe that is my biggest problem with it, it slows the game without ending it?

With regards to Brain in a Jar: Mizzix of the Izmagnus or Melek, Izzet Paragon probably want it more than anybody else. There are others that could use it of course, but those would be my two choices. I think Melek is probably the more interesting of the two, but they are probably similar enough that you could build the deck for one and just switch without much difficulty.

So, who would champion Ball Lightning?

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J. R. R. Tolkien

Shabbaman wrote:
The usual answer is "the social contract", but I guess that is not what you are looking for. Try house rules.


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 Post subject: Re: Forum Game: I Need A Hero!
AgePosted: 2018-Nov-19 4:06 pm 
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Joined: 2009-Aug-20 7:49 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: New Hampshire
Inkeyes22 wrote:
I would say it is almost as format warping as Primeval titan

Nitpick: GAME warping. Sire is definitely NOT warping the format. Thankfully.

Sinis wrote:
I mean, I'm still baffled how you can even consider Sire in the same category of Vorinclex or Iona. The other two usually prevent you from playing half your cards.

Vorinclex makes you not want to tap mana because you're shooting yourself in the foot. Spawnsire makes you not want to play your land for the turn because you're handing your opponent free stuff and milling yourself. Imagine if Consecrated Sphinx let your opponents skip their draws to not have you draw 2... would that suddenly make it a fun card? Hell no. It's still basically saying "don't play the game". Don't even get me started on Overwhelming Splendor - otherwise known as Spectator Mode. And yes, Sire doesn't say "don't play" as loudly as Iona or Specmode... but it says it, and that's not OK. [/Soapbox]

Inkeyes22 wrote:
So, who would champion Ball Lightning?

Definitely Xenagos, God of Revels.

How about Bounty of the Luxa?

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 Post subject: Re: Forum Game: I Need A Hero!
AgePosted: 2018-Nov-20 1:33 am 
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Joined: 2011-Jan-16 5:36 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Toronto, ON
Sid the Chicken wrote:

This card is so bad. I've tried to play it just as generic ramp/draw, and it's not... great. Which is too bad, because I had such high hopes. After I tried it, I asked myself how it could be so bad, and the chief way of identifying that was the following query: would you pay 8 mana for something resembling Thran Dynamo + Archivist? It turns out, the answer is kind of no.

My own personal disappointment with this card notwithstanding, it might be good for tabling a general in u/g while still trying to maintain enough mana to have counterspells mana available. I think Tatyova, Benthic Druid would be the best for this; you'll want to spend the mana to cast Tatyova and *then* play a land to draw. Tatyova is also not especially aggressively costed (and soft to most removal).

Now that we've talked about Brain in a Jar, how do y'all feel about Jar of Eyeballs?

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 Post subject: Re: Forum Game: I Need A Hero!
AgePosted: 2018-Nov-20 6:26 am 
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Joined: 2013-Jul-25 1:15 pm
Age: Dragon
Location: Durham, England
I feel like we skipped one.
spacemonaut wrote:
The basic answer is just to park it in your deck as Consecrated Sphinx #2, a big generic card drawing fun hating bomb. That's lame and boring. There are two ways I would take this. The first is to maximise the cards you're drawing by putting a tonne of lands into play on all sides of the field. The second is to take advantage of the the exile rider.

To maximise your draw with Sire of Stagnation, I'd build a Sultai deck with as many green group hug land ramp cards as possible. Collective Voyage, Tempt with Discovery, Field of Ruin, Avatar of Growth, etc. Then follow it up with some evil ways to take advantage of their improved land count: Think Herald of Leshrac and Gilt-Leaf Archdruid. A good commander of such a deck would probably be Tasigur, the Golden Fang, he gives you something to do with your oceans of mana and is similarly a "fun political" card.

The other option is to take advantage of the exile rider which is otherwise, pretty much irrelevant. One way would be by being a mill deck, the classic Dimir group hug game plan, but Dimir group hug doesn't entice me. Instead, I recommend playing an Eldrazi Processors deck, lead by Jeleva, Nephalia's Scourge. Processor is a subtype of Eldrazi that return opponents' exiled cards to their graveyard, there are a few non-creature cards with processor in the name that do the same thing. The effects of processors are fairly powerful for their cost, since you have to jump through the hoop of exiling opponents' cards, the perfect sort of thing to build a commander deck around. I would look to adding Etali, Primal Storm and Fathom Skulker to the mix as well. Just to give a few other non-Jeleva methods of exiling cards.

Next up: It's still Jar of Eyeballs.

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I had a long hiatus, removed some decks, but I still love lands.
Tatyova, Benthic Druid - Exploring Brawl
Arixmethes, Slumbering Isle - Work in Progress
Yasova Dragonclaw - Yasova Tinyclaw/Slightly-less-tinyclaw
Kruphix, God of Horizons - That Which Was Taken by Kruphix
Selvala, Explorer Returned - Blackless dredge
Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury - Monogreen Superfriends
Pharika, God of Affliction - Hemlock


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 Post subject: Re: Forum Game: I Need A Hero!
AgePosted: 2018-Nov-20 9:33 pm 
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Joined: 2016-Nov-27 2:39 pm
Age: Dragon
I appreciate getting a proper answer to that, thank you.

I also appreciate how evil the Tasigur group hug ramp plan is. :twisted:

(I'm not gonna build that, but wow!)

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Decks: Chaos colored dragons, Mathas, the Instigator (politics and mayhem).
Beloved precons: Atraxa, Praetors' Voice; Saskia the Unyielding; Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury.


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 Post subject: Re: Forum Game: I Need A Hero!
AgePosted: 2018-Nov-21 2:25 pm 
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Joined: 2009-Aug-20 7:49 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: New Hampshire
Ski Gloves wrote:
Next up: It's still Jar of Eyeballs.

Well, this thing wants you to lose your own creatures and rewards you with card selection... while you could just run it out there and get some value when you get wrathed, I think it's best in a deck that snackrifices a lot... maybe Mazirek?

Let's talk Imminent Doom

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"The President's job - and if someone sufficiently vain and stupid is picked he won't realize this - is not to wield power, but to draw attention away from it." -- Douglas Adams, The Hitchhiker's Guide tot he Galaxy Radio Transcripts predicting the future.


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 Post subject: Re: Forum Game: I Need A Hero!
AgePosted: 2018-Nov-26 2:48 am 
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Joined: 2011-Jan-16 5:36 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Toronto, ON
Sid the Chicken wrote:
Let's talk Imminent Doom

For a card with obvious hard limits on the damage it can do without real help, Imminent Doom can actually churn out a fair bit of damage.

First choice is Baron Von Count, since it's on theme for counting but may also be practically worthwhile in that deck with the variety of converted mana costs.

I'm certain there are other commanders where it could be pull its weight, but it would feel like a waste of time in something like Mizzix of the Izmagnus; sure you could cast Fanning the Flames hitting the proper CMC every time, but, you're already playing Mizzix and could be doing something that doesn't feel goofy.

Up next: When it was printed, I was kind of excited, but it's always one of the first cuts in my new lists. I've never actually managed to use Deadbridge Chant. Is it just a terrible card?

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 Post subject: Re: Forum Game: I Need A Hero!
AgePosted: 2018-Nov-26 3:28 am 
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Joined: 2012-Dec-03 3:16 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Sinis wrote:
Up next: When it was printed, I was kind of excited, but it's always one of the first cuts in my new lists. I've never actually managed to use Deadbridge Chant. Is it just a terrible card?


I run it in Izoni, Thousand-Eyed because if they do get rid of it, at least I got the self-mill and if they don't I get serious card advantage. True, it is random but I don't run stuff that I would not want to see back. I do get mana ramp when I already have 7-10 lands on occasion, but that is the worst I get out of it. I will say, most other B/G commanders don't want it so there is that.

What about Fiery Justice?

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"It does not do to leave a live dragon out of your calculations, if you live near him."
J. R. R. Tolkien

Shabbaman wrote:
The usual answer is "the social contract", but I guess that is not what you are looking for. Try house rules.


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 Post subject: Re: Forum Game: I Need A Hero!
AgePosted: 2018-Nov-28 2:07 am 

Joined: 2015-Jan-14 2:58 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Sinis wrote:
Up next: When it was printed, I was kind of excited, but it's always one of the first cuts in my new lists. I've never actually managed to use Deadbridge Chant. Is it just a terrible card?


I like it in B/G/x Relentless Rats. Meren or Karador. Other than that, I probably wouldn’t use it.

Still Fiery Justice.

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Antis wrote:
I'm seriously suspicious of any card that makes Doubling Season look fair and reasonable.


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 Post subject: Re: Forum Game: I Need A Hero!
AgePosted: 2018-Nov-29 6:14 am 
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Joined: 2011-Jan-16 5:36 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Toronto, ON
Inkeyes22 wrote:
What about Fiery Justice?

There are so many aspects to this card that are interesting but not quite there; it can be used to generically answer creatures, but the lifegain part is what sets this card apart from other crappy removal spells. Sadly, it's not in black for False Cure or Tainted Remedy. We could prevent the lifegain (with something like Leyline of Punishment or Stigma Lasher), but then we'd be left wondering why we didn't just play a better card.

Outside of using it as a generically crappy answer, you can use it to efficiently ping several Enrage creatures. Let's say it's best in Gishath, Sun's Avatar, because that's the deck that's going to try and send the most Enrage dinosaurs.

How about Eliminate the Competition?

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 Post subject: Re: Forum Game: I Need A Hero!
AgePosted: 2018-Nov-29 10:02 am 
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Joined: 2009-Aug-20 7:49 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: New Hampshire
Sinis wrote:
How about Eliminate the Competition?

Another card that probably wants to be in Mazirek, or Savra... I'll say Savra.

Next: Oracle's Vault

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"The President's job - and if someone sufficiently vain and stupid is picked he won't realize this - is not to wield power, but to draw attention away from it." -- Douglas Adams, The Hitchhiker's Guide tot he Galaxy Radio Transcripts predicting the future.


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 Post subject: Re: Forum Game: I Need A Hero!
AgePosted: 2018-Nov-29 11:32 am 
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Joined: 2010-Jul-18 9:59 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Sid the Chicken wrote:
Sinis wrote:
How about Eliminate the Competition?
Another card that probably wants to be in Mazirek, or Savra... I'll say Savra.

Next: Oracle's Vault
The problem with Eliminate the Competition (and all the other "sac a creature: kill a creature" spells) in a Savra deck is that if you're sacrificing a black or black/green creature, Savra's trigger will resolve before the kill spell, and there's nothing stopping the opposing player from sacrificing the spell's target anyway. Obv you don't have that problem if you're sacrificing a green or colourless creature. I would be more tempted to put EtC in a token deck where you can sacrifice enough creatures to kill everything and still have dudes left over. Something like Sek'Kuar (where I have it) or a deck with Endrek Sahr, for example.

For Oracle's Vault - seems good in any R/x deck really for a bit more reach in the mid-late game. It is slow without some way to untap it, but it's probably one of those artifacts that flies just under the "I need to kill this" level so you're likely to get *some* value out of it - just realise that the first card you cast off it essentially cost you 6 more mana than usual. I'd consider putting it in my Anax and Cymede deck, for sure.

How's about Kinjalli's Sunwing? Does it just go in everything? Why/why not?

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 Post subject: Re: Forum Game: I Need A Hero!
AgePosted: 2018-Dec-03 6:16 am 
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Joined: 2011-Jan-16 5:36 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Toronto, ON
Viperion wrote:
How's about Kinjalli's Sunwing? Does it just go in everything? Why/why not?

I don't think it belongs in every deck. More than anything, I think it's wanted in an aggressive deck that wants to avoid people blocking. Probably Aurelia, the Warleader, or Derevi, Empyrial Tactician.

I don't think it goes in every deck because, as a generic defensive option that counters haste creatures, there are better options. Authority of the Consuls and Blind Obedience both are more resilient and do a better job of countering haste than Sunwing (because they survive the wrath that you table once there's a critical number of slowed creatures on the table.

Next up: Mouth // Feed (plz not OG Trostani).

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 Post subject: Re: Forum Game: I Need A Hero!
AgePosted: 2018-Dec-03 10:02 am 
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Joined: 2009-Aug-20 7:49 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: New Hampshire
Sinis wrote:
Next up: Mouth // Feed (plz not OG Trostani).

Goes best in a deck that will fill the board with fatties. Thinking Selvala, Heart of the Wild.

Army of the Damned.

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"The President's job - and if someone sufficiently vain and stupid is picked he won't realize this - is not to wield power, but to draw attention away from it." -- Douglas Adams, The Hitchhiker's Guide tot he Galaxy Radio Transcripts predicting the future.


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 Post subject: Re: Forum Game: I Need A Hero!
AgePosted: 2018-Dec-03 12:40 pm 
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Joined: 2010-Oct-26 5:52 am
Age: Drake
Sid the Chicken wrote:
Sinis wrote:
Next up: Mouth // Feed (plz not OG Trostani).

Goes best in a deck that will fill the board with fatties. Thinking Selvala, Heart of the Wild.

Army of the Damned.


The depressing answer to this one is clearly scarab god, preferably with throne of the god pharoah in play.

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Maluko wrote:
We need a clear set of objective rules so that everybody always knows what to expect, and how to prepare for it. As of now, I think I spend more time arguing with players about the format than I do playing fun and interactive games of Commander. And last time I read, this was not the format's purpose.

QFT


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