Login | Register


All times are UTC - 7 hours


It is currently 2019-Oct-20 4:59 am




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 16 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Nightmare and Kokusho Banned 2/29/08
AgePosted: 2008-Feb-28 3:14 pm 

Joined: 2007-Dec-12 7:36 pm
Age: Dragon
:( I can see why they were banned but I am sad to see them go. There is also mention of a few other cards that were considered but dismissed in that post.

Well hope Wizards starts supporting Build Your Own Block so I can play with those cards again.

_________________
iceage4life on MODO
Paper Decks: Sisay, Oona, Intet, Soknar, Sharuum the Gegemon, Nath, Sir Shandlar of Eberyn (Peasent)
Online: Garza Zol, Venser, Sisay, Ghost Council


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Nightmare and Kokusho Banned 2/29/08
AgePosted: 2008-Feb-28 3:45 pm 
EDH Rules Committee
User avatar

Joined: 2006-May-09 4:17 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Calgary, AB
iceage4life wrote:
I am sad to see them go.


Me too.. especially in Kokusho's case :( I knew it had to be done, but didn't really enjoy doing it... it's such a fun card to abuse.

Gavin

PS: There are a few small silver linings for me... not the least of which is that now I get to add two new cards to my Savra decks without cutting anything! Woo! I hate choosing what to cut :P

_________________
Remember: Most legendary creatures have a gender, and most non-legendary ones don't! Use proper pronouns! ;)


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject:
AgePosted: 2008-Feb-29 3:11 am 
User avatar

Joined: 2007-Jul-03 7:50 am
Age: Drake
Location: Belgium
i am happy with the cut, as the cards where heavily abused in our group..
(well actually Kokusho got the axe sooner here :) based on a tha need)

i agree that mind's eye doesn't have that power level that requires it banning

i do agree that the black Myojin is very very very powerfull...
when it hits, it hits hard... for the moment it doesn't hit enough to make it ban worthy i guess...

thx Rules Committee

_________________
- it's only funny till somebody gets hurt, after that it's freakin' hilarious -
EDH Decks... too many ;) current favourite Hokori Prison


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject:
AgePosted: 2008-Mar-01 7:11 pm 

Joined: 2007-Jun-07 1:11 pm
Age: Drake
I agree with Recurring Nightmare, but not Kokusho. I think that because of the banning of RN, Kokusho does not need to be banned.

_________________
Brion Stoutarm: Flinging Serra Avatars since 2007.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject:
AgePosted: 2008-Mar-02 2:06 pm 
User avatar

Joined: 2006-May-21 9:45 am
Age: Drake
Now with RN and Kokusho gone, what are we going to fight about?!


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject:
AgePosted: 2008-Mar-02 3:10 pm 
User avatar

Joined: 2008-Jan-18 10:03 am
Age: Drake
Location: Where the streets have no wraith
EDH is supposed to be about fun, and both those cards just don't really fit that bill, right?

I agree that Recurring is far worse than Kokusho, but they're both a bit over the top.

_________________
Image
Current EDH decks: Garza Zol, Kagemaro
Work in Progress: Isperia, Sek'Kuar


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject:
AgePosted: 2008-Mar-03 1:15 am 

Joined: 2006-Jul-14 12:02 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Wherever I may roam
Sclone wrote:
EDH is supposed to be about fun, and both those cards just don't really fit that bill, right?

I agree that Recurring is far worse than Kokusho, but they're both a bit over the top.


I'd say cheesy is the word you're after. Like Time Stretch too.

Anyway, glad to finally see a resolution on this. My Sek'Kuar deck has been behaving just fine lately without drawing it (RN that is, I've always refused to play with Kokusho) anyway of late.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject:
AgePosted: 2008-Mar-06 7:06 am 

Joined: 2007-Jun-07 1:11 pm
Age: Drake
I wouldn't mind seeing Time Stretch go, either.

It is a card that if you resolve it, usually wins you the game. At the very least, it's two additional combat phases, draw two cards, untap twenty lands.

I don't think Mind's Eye should be banned. If it is, you might cripple decks of certain colors (i.e. WR/R/W/BR, etc.) that don't have other means of drawing multiple cards.

_________________
Brion Stoutarm: Flinging Serra Avatars since 2007.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject:
AgePosted: 2008-Mar-06 11:51 pm 
User avatar

Joined: 2006-May-23 4:14 pm
Age: Drake
We just had a game last night where Time Stretch was cast 7 times (4 player game) - 3 times by myself followed by an Experiment Kraj player playing it 4 times, the 4th one being misdirected by a Niv Mizzet player. The game certainly wasn't decided by the time stretches, although by the end of them only one player was knocked out and there was actually a degree of interactivity involved in the entire exchange. I don't know if banning Stretch is the answer because it does require 10 mana plus in a multiplayer game you have to really make sure to hold on to it until you're in a position where your opponents are mostly tapped out and you can use those extra turns to win.

I can understand why Kokusho and Recurring Nightmare were banned, I can even see a case being made for Stretch and Mindslaver as they reduce interactivity. But I just see this as the start of a slippery slope where, if we are forced to ban card X because the precedents we've set made us ban other, similar cards, it seems like we'll end up with a ban list a mile long and the only way to win a game of EDH is by nibbling at life totals instead of the 'big turns' that have become the hallmark of memorable EDH plays.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject:
AgePosted: 2008-Mar-07 9:32 am 

Joined: 2008-Feb-03 8:51 am
Age: Hatchling
Time stretch costs TEN and isnt even a guarunteed GG in a single-player game. Its not really broken in EDH at all.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject:
AgePosted: 2008-Mar-07 10:58 am 
EDH Rules Committee
User avatar

Joined: 2006-May-09 4:17 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Calgary, AB
I have to agree... Time Stretch costs infi and doesn't actually say "win the game". _Ten_. Even for EDH, a spell which costs double digit mana should be a freakin haymaker.

Sure, if you recurr it and play it a bunch of times and all that jazz then it can "win the game"... but then it's just one part of a multi card combo and there are many of those which win the game. Most of them don't require 12 Mana :)

As for Eye of the Storm I'm inclined to agree with Nomad (he has more experience than me with the card anyway)... it also requires boatloads of mana and multiple cards to win (and anyone with an instant can usually "steal" the win if they're skillfull).

See post in Strategy forums for followup :)

G

_________________
Remember: Most legendary creatures have a gender, and most non-legendary ones don't! Use proper pronouns! ;)


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject:
AgePosted: 2008-Apr-05 8:43 pm 

Joined: 2008-Apr-05 4:28 pm
Age: Wyvern
Cards with manacost 7+ are ment to finish the game, simply because its unlickly that u will even draw that mana lands (in a normal magic game u nearly never get 7 lands in play, maybe if u are control but than u stretch the game anyway and you should win with nearly any finisher you have).

The thing is if a card is so strong AND fast that it is "handle me or die" than you should at least brain if it should be banned.
And the funny thing is Recurring Nightmare is a 2 card combo machine with a good amount of cards, its just 3 mana, its just 1 black, its "nearly" impossible to disenchant, and ofcourse its sick if your General goes hand in hand with it. So its really logic that R.Nightmare is too strong, strange that u guys needed that long to see that (i mean the old school Palynchron/Nightmare decks were incredible strong and it not really gets weaker in Highlander Style formats).

Each 2 card combo is a problem in its own, if the combination is "unlickly" or "slow" its no problem (i mean even Mindslaver + Academy Ruins is sick, but slow).
If combos win turn 4-5 its very fast and if they do that consistent and beating the hell out of every opponent, its a sign that this combo needs a ban in its keypart.

If u wanna have a bunch of fast combos i wrote them in a threat.

_________________
If u take me too serious, you may explode ...


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject:
AgePosted: 2008-Apr-11 8:14 am 

Joined: 2008-Jan-25 8:26 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Calgary
Thank you thank you thank you thank you for banning Kokusho.

I am getting my friends to start playing EDH for our weekly casual multiplayer and my one friend didn't realize it was banned. So we let it go for the first night.

Gods. Get Kokusho out and it becomes the game. Bouncing it? Oh, it's back. Killing it? Oh, look, he gained 15 life and will recur / reanimate it next turn.

Yuck.

Then my friend laughed and said 'good thing its banned, I was thinking of making it a General' :shock:


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject:
AgePosted: 2008-Apr-21 7:09 pm 

Joined: 2008-Apr-20 7:43 pm
Age: Wyvern
koke's really not that hard to deal with... any white deck can play swords, any blue deck can play bounces & counters, and any deck of any color can play duplicant. what's really fun is cloning your opponent's koke.... then everybody but the two of you gets rocked. wonderful. still, if you're gonna ban a kamigawa dragon, then keiga's the one to go for.... so much better. especially in a 40-life format.

recurring nightmare's pretty insane though. good job.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject:
AgePosted: 2008-Apr-21 7:18 pm 
User avatar

Joined: 2008-Apr-09 1:32 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Horse wrote:
koke's really not that hard to deal with... any white deck can play swords, any blue deck can play bounces & counters, and any deck of any color can play duplicant. what's really fun is cloning your opponent's koke.... then everybody but the two of you gets rocked. wonderful. still, if you're gonna ban a kamigawa dragon, then keiga's the one to go for.... so much better. especially in a 40-life format.

recurring nightmare's pretty insane though. good job.


I agree, I fear Yosei more. even with 20 starting life, i still fear Yosei more.

but

Not everyone will run the aforementioned solutions. Bounce is not proper removal, and not everyone will have Duplicant ready to deal with the Kokusho. In fact not everyone will have duplicant. I prolly wouldn't have as much of a problem w. Koko if it wasn't smack in the reanimation colors. Playing him = automatic target in multi and half the time the opposition can't do much about it anyway.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 16 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 7 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Spectrar Ghost and 28 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: