MTG Commander/Elder Dragon Highlander
http://mtgcommander.net/Forum/

let's talk unbanning.
http://mtgcommander.net/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=19114
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Author:  sicklyjewel [ 2019-May-28 3:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: let's talk unbanning.

Why did people here feel the need to be so pretentious and condescending when responding to RonB?

Author:  Panphage [ 2019-May-28 4:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: let's talk unbanning.

I must say that I'm very confused that anyone would try to equate Braids to Sheoldred and Anowon. Unlike them, Braids will continue to make you sacrifice permanents when you don't have any creatures left. The fact that she causes her owner to sacrifice things is a minor inconvenience in a mono-black deck built to run her at the helm.

I don't think that enough has changed in the game to warrant her being unbanned. There are some very narrow answers that can't be played in most color combinations. I think that it's unreasonable to demand any action regarding her unless there is a serious change that makes her less efficient at killing games.

Author:  Carthain [ 2019-May-29 12:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: let's talk unbanning.

sicklyjewel wrote:
Why did people here feel the need to be so pretentious and condescending when responding to RonB?

Part of it is because we've seen this kind of person before: They come in and act like they know better, but have no knowledge or experience of the past, thus they don't know why we're on the current road/path that we're on.

There are a few simple things that people can do to avoid this kind of response. First, you could (as I suggested above) do some research on the topic. You can look around the forums and find posts about the why things are for many of the Commander rules. If you can't find them, then you can always take the second option: ask about things. So instead of coming in and saying "Hey, I think things should change - here's what I want to have changed" a slight change in attitude of "Hey, I think thinks should be different, so why are they the way they currently are?" is a significant difference, and will be met with a much different form of response from other posters.

Take a look at (one of) Panphage's first posts: http://mtgcommander.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=237098#p237098 ... you can see the reception is much different.

But in RonB's case, he continued to show a complete lack of knowledge about the ban list, but wanting to continue talking about it. For those know do know some of the reasoning behind the various bans, it's incredibly frustrating. Doubly so because 90%+ of the information is available on these forums and can be found with a bit of searching.

We have a fair share of people here who have differing opinions on any number of topics - but the older posters here have the experience with the cards they are talking about (which is granted much easier for cards you want banned such as Iona or Tooth & Nail, than for banned cards) and they don't devolve their arguments to "[so] my opinion is wrong because I don't agree with you." Also, most (I'm pretty sure not all) regular posters here try to read the whole reply that someone gives when wanting to debate things here, and RonB seemed to read the first bit of a reply and then carry on.

To sum up, there are reasonable ways to disagree with people here and there are unreasonable ways. RonB took the latter route and many people here don't like that, so it impacts the tone of how they post replies.

Author:  sicklyjewel [ 2019-May-29 2:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: let's talk unbanning.

So the immediate response to someone having an inexperienced opinion is to condescend them? I would hope that the old timers on this forum would be a little more mature than that.

Author:  Inkeyes22 [ 2019-May-29 3:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: let's talk unbanning.

So I have been here for a bit, and certainly had some disagreements with many here, but expecting imperfect people to handle situations perfectly isn't practical. There have been quite a few people pop in post once or twice on topics that are not new to us and get very angry when people don't immediately agree. Who's problem is it? Well that depends. If people want the community to grow, then it is the communities problem. If we want to develop an echo chamber, than we should put down discenting opinions with haste.

To be clear, I am pretty much anti-banning. I would probably have less than 10 cards banned as I strongly feel that people should be able to play with the cards they own. However, I do understand that some cards ruin games, and people like myself get few opportunities to play.

If someone casts Biorythm to kill everybody but themselves on turn 6+ it might be a little anti-climatic but I would be okay with it. if they cast it on t2 with the only creature on the field being their Dryad Arbor I will be less than excited. Frankly when I am playing EDH I want the games to last longer than it takes to shuffle up. I want everybody to feel like they contributed, and ideally everybody felt like they could have won.

Author:  Uktabi_Kong [ 2019-May-29 3:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: let's talk unbanning.

sicklyjewel wrote:
So the immediate response to someone having an inexperienced opinion is to condescend them?

Please don't strawman people. That's not what Carthain said, and nobody's case is helped by pretending it is.

On a related note, I've generally found that in both my arguments and arguments that others present, it's very rare that a sentence will start with the word "so" and not be a strawman.

Author:  sicklyjewel [ 2019-May-29 4:04 am ]
Post subject:  Re: let's talk unbanning.

Honestly a huge issue with this forum is that the people who have been here for years (like Carthain and others) see themselves as somehow better and above new users. They think it's okay to condescend them and actively try to make them feel stupid because it helps their massive inflated ego. That kind of attitude is pathetic and toxic, and is one of the many reasons why this forum is terrible.

Author:  Carthain [ 2019-May-29 4:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: let's talk unbanning.

sicklyjewel wrote:
Honestly a huge issue with this forum is that the people who have been here for years (like Carthain and others) see themselves as somehow better and above new users. They think it's okay to condescend them and actively try to make them feel stupid because it helps their massive inflated ego. That kind of attitude is pathetic and toxic, and is one of the many reasons why this forum is terrible.

Okay, so this thread has already had someone who has demonstratively proven not to listen to what other people are saying. Are you trying to up that count? Nothing of what you described is what I did (and I'm pretty sure I'm one of the prominent posters in this thread.) I haven't looked too closely at other poster's responses, except perhaps yours now.

I don't think any of what you just said is true. At least, if it is true, then it's certainly not true as a broad stroke that you've given it.

You talk about "old timers" on the forum not acting maturely, and then immediately in your next post go on to demonstrate responses that are even less mature than what has previously happened in this thread.

If you have actual issues, perhaps you should point out specifics so they can be addressed. If you think people should behave better, then you should lead by example. You're not doing any of that here.

Author:  sicklyjewel [ 2019-May-29 4:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: let's talk unbanning.

There's that classic elitist attitude again :roll:

Author:  cryogen [ 2019-May-29 4:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: let's talk unbanning.

Sickly, did you just create an account today with the sole intention of crapping over multiple threads? Because you're wasting your time if that's the case. It's not elitist or condescending to dismiss users that come on here with the attitude you have, no matter how much you try to convince us otherwise.

Author:  Carthain [ 2019-May-29 4:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: let's talk unbanning.

I love how it's "elitist" to ask for examples so we can try to improve things :facepalm:

Author:  cryogen [ 2019-May-29 5:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: let's talk unbanning.

Carthain wrote:
I love how it's "elitist" to ask for examples so we can try to improve things :facepalm:

It's probably because of your monocle.

Author:  tgambitg [ 2019-May-29 7:03 am ]
Post subject:  Re: let's talk unbanning.

sicklyjewel wrote:
Honestly a huge issue with this forum is that the people who have been here for years (like Carthain and others) see themselves as somehow better and above new users. They think it's okay to condescend them and actively try to make them feel stupid because it helps their massive inflated ego. That kind of attitude is pathetic and toxic, and is one of the many reasons why this forum is terrible.



Goddamn it Carthain.... I rarely post and you always forget to condescend to me!!! Are you so elitist that you get to pick and choose who to condescend to?

But in reality, sicklyjewel, If you come in, throw down some accusations with no examples and proof, you're gonna have a bad time. If you want serious discussion (along with RonB), you need to provide some sort of reasoning and some examples, or you will not find a warm reception, because you are being rude and condescending yourself.

Author:  Sid the Chicken [ 2019-May-29 8:30 am ]
Post subject:  Re: let's talk unbanning.

Guys, honestly it wouldn't surprise me if RonB and Sickly are the same person, and he made a second account for the express purpose of trolling you, in which case you're taking the bait. He's a troll at best, and should not be fed.

Author:  sicklyjewel [ 2019-May-29 2:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: let's talk unbanning.

Quote:
Guys, honestly it wouldn't surprise me if RonB and Sickly are the same person, and he made a second account for the express purpose of trolling you, in which case you're taking the bait. He's a troll at best, and should not be fed.


Is your ego so huge that it's impossible to imagine that more than one person might disagree with your opinion?

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