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 Post subject: Sylvan Primordial / Primeval Titan
AgePosted: 2014-Feb-03 7:29 am 

Joined: 2014-Feb-03 6:18 am
Age: Hatchling
My play group talked over the weekend and decide if Sylvan Primordial was going to be banned we would ignore it. In our group he has the board on about turn 7-10 so he is not as problematic. We changed the wording on Primeval Titan before his banning. We limited Primeval Titan to only getting basic land. So we still allow him too.

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 Post subject: Re: Sylvan Primordial / Primeval Titan
AgePosted: 2014-Feb-03 8:06 am 

Joined: 2008-Aug-02 10:17 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Good for you!

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 Post subject: Re: Sylvan Primordial / Primeval Titan
AgePosted: 2014-Feb-03 8:18 am 
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Joined: 2009-Aug-20 7:49 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: New Hampshire
Draymore wrote:
We changed the wording on Primeval Titan before his banning. We limited Primeval Titan to only getting basic land. So we still allow him too.

I am 100% sure that if he was actually printed that way, he wouldn't be banned. But the RC doesn't and shouldn't do card-specific errata, especially functional changes like that, so unfortunately it's no more prime-time for us.

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 Post subject: Re: Sylvan Primordial / Primeval Titan
AgePosted: 2014-Feb-03 9:48 am 

Joined: 2012-Apr-11 7:17 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Draymore wrote:
My play group talked over the weekend and decide if Sylvan Primordial was going to be banned we would ignore it. In our group he has the board on about turn 7-10 so he is not as problematic. We changed the wording on Primeval Titan before his banning. We limited Primeval Titan to only getting basic land. So we still allow him too.
This is exactly how the ban list should operate. The RC sets the 'base rules', and your group decides on what is most fun for you.

I also appreciate you seemed to tackle it in a mature way, which is refreshing here on the internet.

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 Post subject: Re: Sylvan Primordial / Primeval Titan
AgePosted: 2014-Feb-03 10:19 am 

Joined: 2014-Feb-03 6:18 am
Age: Hatchling
Sid the Chicken wrote:
Draymore wrote:
We changed the wording on Primeval Titan before his banning. We limited Primeval Titan to only getting basic land. So we still allow him too.

I am 100% sure that if he was actually printed that way, he wouldn't be banned. But the RC doesn't and shouldn't do card-specific errata, especially functional changes like that, so unfortunately it's no more prime-time for us.


I agree in a tournament based area it is easier to say cards X are out. Errata of cards leads to problems at tournaments cause then you get the group of people say , "that is not what the cards says!!!"

For example of one of the other errata we have is Woodfall Primus come into play ability may only trigger twice. even if you annihilate the persist counter.

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 Post subject: Re: Sylvan Primordial / Primeval Titan
AgePosted: 2014-Feb-03 5:46 pm 

Joined: 2011-Aug-12 6:32 am
Age: Hatchling
wow turn 7... lucky.
I'm often able to get him to hit the field turn two.
Turn one if i'm lucky.

Land + Mox diamond let all your opponents have a turn and lay a land, end of the last opponents turn flash


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 Post subject: Re: Sylvan Primordial / Primeval Titan
AgePosted: 2014-Feb-03 7:38 pm 

Joined: 2009-Jan-23 11:34 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Draymore wrote:
My play group talked over the weekend and decide if Sylvan Primordial was going to be banned we would ignore it. In our group he has the board on about turn 7-10 so he is not as problematic. We changed the wording on Primeval Titan before his banning. We limited Primeval Titan to only getting basic land. So we still allow him too.

Your group seems AWESOME!

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Spekter wrote:
niheloim wrote:
Aggravated Assault + Bear Umbra = My attempt to make my group move to ban Uril.
That's not ban-worthy, that's the spirit of EDH. Three-card combo involving the combat phase? Awesome.


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 Post subject: Re: Sylvan Primordial / Primeval Titan
AgePosted: 2014-Feb-03 10:35 pm 

Joined: 2014-Feb-03 10:18 pm
Age: Egg
I wasn't even aware using Flash to dump the guy into play was a common thing, but after listening to people on MtgSalvation and here it sounds like people go out of their way to win at the expense of everyone else's fun. >_>;

Apparently I'd been running Sylvan Primordial in Roon without ever soulbonding him to Deadeye Navigator; it just never seemed necessary. When I told my playgroup today that Sylvan Prime got banned they went, "Wtf" until we started looking at the forums, and then they realized the only reason they had no problems with it was because I'd stop using Sylvan Prime once I fetched out my Forests (with Wood Elves and Yavimaya Dryad in the same 3 color deck, I tend to run out of lands with that basic land type pretty quickly). Then again, I ran Sylvan in the same slot as Primeval Titan was supposed to take so I treated Sylvan Prime solely as mana ramp as I had 4-5 other things in the deck to remove/stop instant win combos that didn't force me to make an enemy out of the whole table.

Hell, I'm confused at this whole, "If you run green you HAVE to run Sylvan Primordial because reasons" mentality being expressed on various websites simply because I have 3 decks: Arcum Dagsson (our meta is competitive quality but laid back as all hell, if you can't tell), Roon, which has a Sylvan Primordial, and Ghave, which doesn't have it or need it since it combos out just fine without. I literally just gave one to my buddy who has Mayel the Aria, so he's probably going to give his copy back to me, but he's thinking more along the lines of Vorinclex to replace it while I'm going with Karametra for ramping purposes lol.

Then again, we also have a, "No fun-sucking" rule, which is basically everyone else's don't be a douchebag rule. If somebody's idea of fun is making the game not fun for anybody else then we generally tend to not play Commander/multiplayer at that point and just whip out our Legacy or Modern decks (and I play Enchantress, Painter, Reanimator and Deathblade, so I always have something to catch somebody off guard with if they want an unfun game).

Anyway, all I'm saying in this incredibly verbose post is: People should be more considerate, I guess. It's weird we need a ban list to keep people from douching it up, but I guess there will always be those kinds of people. My group is adhering to the new banning but it's not like that creature made our games incredibly unfun. Actually, everyone scrambling to copy Vorinclexes and Consecrated Sphinxes does that sometimes, but even that can lead to really interesting game states.


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 Post subject: Re: Sylvan Primordial / Primeval Titan
AgePosted: 2014-Feb-04 6:42 am 

Joined: 2014-Feb-03 6:18 am
Age: Hatchling
PookandPie wrote:
I wasn't even aware using Flash to dump the guy into play was a common thing, but after listening to people on MtgSalvation and here it sounds like people go out of their way to win at the expense of everyone else's fun. >_>;

Then again, we also have a, "No fun-sucking" rule, which is basically everyone else's don't be a douchebag rule. If somebody's idea of fun is making the game not fun for anybody else then we generally tend to not play Commander/multiplayer at that point and just whip out our Legacy or Modern decks (and I play Enchantress, Painter, Reanimator and Deathblade, so I always have something to catch somebody off guard with if they want an unfun game).


Yeah we don't play flash cause you can do dumb shit with it. No land destruction except like things like tectonic edge for cradle and such. I stopped going to the local store because people were douchebags. Told my friends you told there friends that we would play at my place. So 1-2 times a week me and the wife have 4-6 people over and play commander.

Best play yet Genesis Wave for 23 putting 20 permanents into play and getting killed before my next turn :)

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 Post subject: Re: Sylvan Primordial / Primeval Titan
AgePosted: 2014-Feb-04 7:01 am 
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Joined: 2012-Nov-27 4:39 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Midgard
PookandPie wrote:
I wasn't even aware using Flash to dump the guy into play was a common thing, but after listening to people on MtgSalvation and here it sounds like people go out of their way to win at the expense of everyone else's fun. >_>;

Apparently I'd been running Sylvan Primordial in Roon without ever soulbonding him to Deadeye Navigator; it just never seemed necessary. When I told my playgroup today that Sylvan Prime got banned they went, "Wtf" until we started looking at the forums, and then they realized the only reason they had no problems with it was because I'd stop using Sylvan Prime once I fetched out my Forests (with Wood Elves and Yavimaya Dryad in the same 3 color deck, I tend to run out of lands with that basic land type pretty quickly). Then again, I ran Sylvan in the same slot as Primeval Titan was supposed to take so I treated Sylvan Prime solely as mana ramp as I had 4-5 other things in the deck to remove/stop instant win combos that didn't force me to make an enemy out of the whole table.

Hell, I'm confused at this whole, "If you run green you HAVE to run Sylvan Primordial because reasons" mentality being expressed on various websites simply because I have 3 decks: Arcum Dagsson (our meta is competitive quality but laid back as all hell, if you can't tell), Roon, which has a Sylvan Primordial, and Ghave, which doesn't have it or need it since it combos out just fine without. I literally just gave one to my buddy who has Mayel the Aria, so he's probably going to give his copy back to me, but he's thinking more along the lines of Vorinclex to replace it while I'm going with Karametra for ramping purposes lol.

Then again, we also have a, "No fun-sucking" rule, which is basically everyone else's don't be a douchebag rule. If somebody's idea of fun is making the game not fun for anybody else then we generally tend to not play Commander/multiplayer at that point and just whip out our Legacy or Modern decks (and I play Enchantress, Painter, Reanimator and Deathblade, so I always have something to catch somebody off guard with if they want an unfun game).

Anyway, all I'm saying in this incredibly verbose post is: People should be more considerate, I guess. It's weird we need a ban list to keep people from douching it up, but I guess there will always be those kinds of people. My group is adhering to the new banning but it's not like that creature made our games incredibly unfun. Actually, everyone scrambling to copy Vorinclexes and Consecrated Sphinxes does that sometimes, but even that can lead to really interesting game states.

It's an unfortunate syndrome running around currently. I would agree with you, in multiple places with what you are saying, but specifically about falling under the assumption that any particular card absolutely must be played or you're not a real Magic player (or something ridiculous like that).

While it is true some cards will always be better than other cards, get some fortitude or self control not to play them every single time. Or pick a theme and force yourself to stick to it.

Anyway, good for you that your group acts with relatively level heads while playing the game. I would enjoy seeing that for once. I actually do run Flash in one deck, and I only play it because the deck's plays being mostly on turns 6-8 (while every turn before that is ramping or mana fixing--5-color deck and all). So it helps get an exile effect from Luminate Primordial or something else of that nature just to keep me in the game while everyone else shoots ahead.

Any group which can play a banned card reasonably and with enough self control not to create unfun game states, there's no reason they can't continue to do so. It is really entirely up to the play group.

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 Post subject: Re: Sylvan Primordial / Primeval Titan
AgePosted: 2014-Feb-04 10:14 am 

Joined: 2009-Jan-23 11:34 am
Age: Elder Dragon
In my experience, this 'must play' attitude is a carry over from the influx of players coming from tournament formats.

TBH, though, my feeling is there's room enough for every type of player on EDH; you don't have to play with anyone you don't want to since it's a non-sanctioned format.

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Spekter wrote:
niheloim wrote:
Aggravated Assault + Bear Umbra = My attempt to make my group move to ban Uril.
That's not ban-worthy, that's the spirit of EDH. Three-card combo involving the combat phase? Awesome.


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 Post subject: Re: Sylvan Primordial / Primeval Titan
AgePosted: 2014-Feb-04 3:47 pm 

Joined: 2010-Apr-19 12:43 pm
Age: Drake
shintaru wrote:
Land + Mox diamond let all your opponents have a turn and lay a land, end of the last opponents turn flash

So you just reshuffle your decks and draw new 7 cards :P And play another 3v1 free for all game.


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 Post subject: Re: Sylvan Primordial / Primeval Titan
AgePosted: 2014-Feb-04 9:10 pm 

Joined: 2009-Apr-21 3:38 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Palm Springs Area, CA
Silencer wrote:
shintaru wrote:
Land + Mox diamond let all your opponents have a turn and lay a land, end of the last opponents turn flash

So you just reshuffle your decks and draw new 7 cards :P And play another 3v1 free for all game.
or! Find a new player for that 4th seat.

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 Post subject: Re: Sylvan Primordial / Primeval Titan
AgePosted: 2014-Feb-05 12:29 am 

Joined: 2012-Oct-09 1:35 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Stoke-On-Trent, England, UK
on the 'must play' bits of this discussion I whole heartedly think if you play blue and don't run mulldrifter you are doing it wrong ;-P hes awesome!

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 Post subject: Re: Sylvan Primordial / Primeval Titan
AgePosted: 2014-Feb-05 10:01 am 

Joined: 2011-Aug-12 6:32 am
Age: Hatchling
Silencer wrote:
shintaru wrote:
Land + Mox diamond let all your opponents have a turn and lay a land, end of the last opponents turn flash

So you just reshuffle your decks and draw new 7 cards :P And play another 3v1 free for all game.


Pretty much. Will only do something like that if someone starts the game with a layline and there is multiple sol ring turn one drops.

After a game like that I won't play my Riku deck for the rest of the night hah. Just waiting for profit and dead eye to get the ban hammer now.


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