MTG Commander/Elder Dragon Highlander

Unban Library of Alexandria
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Author:  Jayke [ 2007-Jul-03 7:57 am ]
Post subject:  Unban Library of Alexandria

I don't feel this card is either broken or unfun.. but i would like to see other opinions in this.

plz don't just vote, motivate

Author:  Gis [ 2007-Jul-03 8:19 am ]
Post subject: 

Maybe, it's to easy to include in all decks and that would mean I need one for every deck which is rather expensive..

It's unfun in a way that when the person with seven cards gets to abuse, the library really helps to keep him in control of the game.

That situation doesn't happen that often in EDH so I would probably be for unbanning it, but with a big Maybe!

Author:  Philatio [ 2007-Jul-03 9:37 am ]
Post subject: 

Well, I've been dying to find a use for mine since I quit type 1 and started playing this format exclusively. I have no idea what deck would get it over the others.

I vote yes without frankly having seen it in action at a multiplayer table. Then again, with all the Mazes of Ith and Kor Havens and nuttiness we run, there is a lot of targeted land hate in our group.

Author:  Ban Ki-moon [ 2007-Jul-03 12:49 pm ]
Post subject: 

Library of Alexandria is banned, I think, for the same reasons as the Moxen are. They are unattainable for the average player.

The nature of the format squelches the overwhelming power of these cards (not to say that they aren't still amazing), so they won't necessarily dominate a table all on their own, but the concept of losing to a Library is less fun than losing to Survival of the Fittest or, topically, Recurring Nightmare.

The enchantments can be had for around ten dollars each for any willing cardholder, giving them hope that they can do very well with a little bit of tweaking to their decks. The Power is far, far out of reach for most, leaving these players with nothing but the empty sensation that the kids with the richest parents will always beat them.

Author:  Genomancer [ 2007-Jul-03 1:58 pm ]
Post subject: 

Ban Ki-moon wrote:
They are unattainable for the average player.

Indeed. There are a number of reasons a card might be banned in EDH (see the rules announcement forum for clarification)... Library fits one of them very clearly. If one is going to suggest a card be banned, it shouldn't be done with a poll so much as a discussion.


Author:  Philatio [ 2007-Jul-03 3:40 pm ]
Post subject: 

Genomancer wrote:
Ban Ki-moon wrote:
They are unattainable for the average player.

Indeed. There are a number of reasons a card might be banned in EDH (see the rules announcement forum for clarification)... Library fits one of them very clearly. If one is going to suggest a card be banned, it shouldn't be done with a poll so much as a discussion.


I've seen the criteria on the rules page before, and don't question the spirit by any means. It is certainly warranted in every case listed, perhaps in this one (my local group has toyed with allowing Timetwister since it isn't that more powerful than the other draw 7s, it's fun, and two people own them).
But group versus official rules isn't the real point, so nevermind on that.

This particular criteria of cost isn't so cut and dry, however. What about Mishra's Workshop? I don't own one - it is legal in this format, yet it retails for higher than Library. I've thought about trading my useless (in this format) Library to trade for a workshop in my artifact deck.

Illusionary Mask would get played more if it didn't cost around $100.

Heck, cards I play in my decks that cost a bit but are legal include The Abyss, Bazaar of Baghdad, Imperial Seal, Grim Tutor, and Mana Drain. In most cases I run the cheap knock off versions, too, so I'm not trying to show off as much as get the best effect for the deck.

I guess I'm asking at what arbitrary dollar value or scarcity do you draw the line? I suppose the Power 10 is a very good line for simplicity when making a broad set of rules for everyone that doesn't get too nitpicky.

Author:  Jayke [ 2007-Jul-05 2:44 am ]
Post subject: 

i can play timetwister, bazaar of baghdad etc... , i can play a lot off cards with a lot of value...
the question is, why do we determine that a card can't be played because it has a high cost..

off course if it is overpowered, i agree...

is it overpowered? is it more overpowered than a maze of ith, tolarian academy, safe haven (lolz) ...

Author:  LovesTha [ 2007-Jul-08 10:24 pm ]
Post subject: 

Cards that improve most decks and are seriously exspensive should remain banned.

Mishra's Workshop and other exspensive unbanned cards tend to be much more narrow in their applications. So a player is unlikely to want 1 in each EDH deck. Also people are unlikely to build the deck that they are needed in unless they want to purchase such cards.

I know that I'd want a library in every one of my decks if it was legal, but I doubt I'll ever own more than 1 (currently 0)

Author:  Jayke [ 2007-Jul-08 11:35 pm ]
Post subject: 

i can see your point,

i don't own more then one LoA, but i would see it hit play, i wouldn't play it in every deck i have, i would play it in a blue driven edh deck
for me its like sayin

Sure your green black survival genesis deck can have the Bazaar of bagdad
Sure your artifact deck can use the Workshop
nope you can't use the Library in your blue black deck

i would possibly play the bazaar in a lot of decks (if i had one) but i only have a Library of Alexandria which i can't play :shock: :lol:

Author:  farsheur [ 2008-Jan-18 8:54 am ]
Post subject: 

I completely agree with Jayke on that.

Sure the real card is unattainable for the average player but is that a good reason for banning it?? You may just print some proxy who cares honestly.

Author:  Genomancer [ 2008-Jan-18 10:59 am ]
Post subject: 

farsheur wrote:
but is that a good reason for banning it??

Yes :)

You may just print some proxy who cares honestly.

No/Lots of people.

Gavin :)

Author:  AKFox [ 2008-Jan-18 7:05 pm ]
Post subject: 

If being expensive qualifies a card for banning, why are Bazaar, Workshop, Timetwister and Mana Drain still legal? You may as well ban Juzam Djinn as well, while you're at it.

Library is good, but it's also fragile. Most of the time it just taps for 1. On power level alone banning is not justified. If price is an issue with legality, every other card above $100 or so should be banned as well, but clearly they are not. You guys are free to make rulings however you wish, but try to make them consistently.

Author:  Philatio [ 2008-Jan-18 7:36 pm ]
Post subject: 

I should so just proxy a Mishra's Workshop in my Jhoira deck instead of trading my Library towards a real one. Who cares about real cards? Ugh.

Author:  matthew [ 2008-Jan-19 9:33 am ]
Post subject: 

One of the key points of EDH is that it's accessible which means that it's also competitive no matter what your card pool looks like.

Since EDH (being a multiplayer format) allows players to draw a card on turn one this card can become troublesome.

(IMHO - proxies make no sense in EDH at all. As a rule, you don't need those big expensive cards to compete with those who have them. There are those cards like RN that break that rule but even then it's still a problem that can be solved. Something like Moxen cannot reliably be solved so their banning makes sense.)

Author:  Jayke [ 2008-Jan-21 12:51 am ]
Post subject: 

I stopped paying attention to this topic as it seems unclear why people disallow it... The only reasonable comment being the prize tag has allready been shattered by other cards in the format

and anyone claiming Library in EDH is broken.. has possibly not tried it in multiplayer :)

Library is possibly broken if you get it turn one...

but then again... i only own one, and therefore i stopped discussing this.

proxies? eum... no

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