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 Post subject: Phyrexian Ingester vs. Commander
AgePosted: 2012-Jan-05 11:48 am 

Joined: 2010-Sep-08 9:21 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
This came up in our new twice-weekly game.

Phyrexian Ingester targets a Commander. The commander goes to the command zone instead of exile. Phyrexian Ingester enters as a 3/3 with no bonus?

Phyrexian Ingester targets Skullbriar, the Walking Grave with counters on him, and the opponent chooses to exile him rather than put him in the command zone, for whatever reason. Does Ingester get +1/+1 (because it says "card") or does it get +X/+X based on the current P/T of Skullbriar?

If Ingester's target is removed from exile (say, with Riftsweeper) does Ingester lose its bonus or does he get to keep it?

Thanks!

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Thraxiumundar - Sacrifice Effects
Sachi, Daughter of Seshiro - Shaman Tribal Ramp
Darien, King of Kjeldor - Go Ahead and Attack
Talrand, Sky Summoner - Nothin' but Counters, Bounce & Draw


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 Post subject: Re: Phyrexian Ingester vs. Commander
AgePosted: 2012-Jan-05 12:07 pm 

Joined: 2011-Sep-30 6:08 am
Age: Elder Dragon
It only gets +x/+y if there is a creature card in the Exile zone that was put there with his imprint ability.

Skullbriar gives +1/+1.

A commander that is moved to the command zone gives no bonus.

A Tarmogoyf gives +*/+*+1.

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 Post subject: Re: Phyrexian Ingester vs. Commander
AgePosted: 2012-Jan-05 12:19 pm 

Joined: 2010-Sep-28 8:44 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Hamilton, ON
crokaycete wrote:
It only gets +x/+y if there is a creature card in the Exile zone that was put there with his imprint ability.

Skullbriar gives +1/+1.

A commander that is moved to the command zone gives no bonus.

A Tarmogoyf gives +*/+*+1.


Basically, it gets the bonus based on the base p/t of the creature in question, modified by CDAs (Tarmogoyf's *'s for example). Counters are not a CDA.

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Norin the Wary (chaos control)
Talrand (mono-U tempo/Proteus Staff combo)


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 Post subject: Re: Phyrexian Ingester vs. Commander
AgePosted: 2012-Jan-06 8:49 am 
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Joined: 2010-Aug-17 12:14 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Nashua/Salem, NH
What's CDA?

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Garza Zol
Edric
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 Post subject: Re: Phyrexian Ingester vs. Commander
AgePosted: 2012-Jan-06 8:57 am 
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Joined: 2010-Mar-12 3:20 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
crokaycete wrote:
Skullbriar gives +1/+1.

Incorrect. Skullbriar will give +1/+1, plus an additonal +1/+1 for each +1/+1 counter on it. +1/+1 counters remain on Skullbriar, and continue to affect his power and toughness, even while in exile.

See the below rule:
121.1a. A +X/+Y counter on a creature or on a creature card in a zone other than the battlefield, where X and Y are numbers, adds X to that object's power and Y to that object's toughness. Similarly, -X/-Y counters subtract from power and toughness. See rule 613.3.

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Alesha, She who Smiles at Death.....Atraxa, Praetors' Voice.....Eight-and-a-Half-Tails.....Gonti, Lord of Luxury.....Karametra, God of Harvests.....Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker.....Kozilek, the Great Distortion.....Prime Speaker Zegana.....Rubinia Soulsinger.....Thrasios, Triton Hero + Vial Smasher the Fierce

My general commander philosophy: Using your opponent's degenerate cards against them is far more satisfying than playing degenerate cards yourself.


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 Post subject: Re: Phyrexian Ingester vs. Commander
AgePosted: 2012-Jan-06 9:13 am 

Joined: 2010-Sep-28 8:44 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Hamilton, ON
kaldare wrote:
crokaycete wrote:
Skullbriar gives +1/+1.

Incorrect. Skullbriar will give +1/+1, plus an additonal +1/+1 for each +1/+1 counter on it. +1/+1 counters remain on Skullbriar, and continue to affect his power and toughness, even while in exile.

See the below rule:
121.1a. A +X/+Y counter on a creature or on a creature card in a zone other than the battlefield, where X and Y are numbers, adds X to that object's power and Y to that object's toughness. Similarly, -X/-Y counters subtract from power and toughness. See rule 613.3.


Oops! Looks like we forgot the primary rule of giving ruling: RTFC. Yes, in this one corner case the counters will matter becuase they remain on Skullbriar, whereas for every other creature currently in print this would not be the case.

shmebula wrote:
What's CDA?


A CDA is a Characteristic Defining Ability, ie: "this card is blue" or "the *'s in Tarmogoyf's P/T is equal to the number of different card types in all graveyards". It's an ability that sets a characteristic to a specific value, rather than a static bonus or penalty like that provided by a counter.

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Norin the Wary (chaos control)
Talrand (mono-U tempo/Proteus Staff combo)


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