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 Post subject: Grimgrin again + Squirrely Sacrifice Synergy (SSS!)
AgePosted: 2018-Mar-01 6:50 am 

Joined: 2010-Apr-16 6:59 am
Age: Drake
Location: Freemont, NE (Omaha area) USA
I'll start with a big shout out to Squirrely, without whose work on his Endrek Sahr sacrifice synergy deck, this post would not be possible. THX Squirrely! For those of you who may not have seen it, you can find it here: viewtopic.php?f=16&t=12196
It's loaded with great ideas and is the seminal influence for this version of Grimgrin.

I am listing this in a pretty non standard manner, based on function. it's the order I use when laying the deck out on the table for contemplation and possible upgrade.

Commander - and primary sac outlet
Grimgrin, Corpse-Born

The Big Synergy in 3 parts:
Pivots - Making everyone else suffers when I sacrifice;
Pain and Suffering for opponents;
Compensation and Benefits for me;

Pivots
Grave Pact
Butcher of Malakir
Dictate of Erebos
Ruthless Deathfang - Situational, but close enough.
Does anyone know of more even remotely Grave Pact like effects?

Pain and Suffering and Crowd Control
Fleshbag Marauder
Merciless Executioner
Slum Reaper
Bone Shredder - Gets sacked to it's own echo, or used as flying chump.
There are a number of other possibilities such as Abyssal Gatekeeper, Shriekmaw, and any other creatures with the 'Evoke' ability.

Comp & Benies
Blood Artist
Falkenrath Noble
Zulaport Cutthroat
Deathgreeter
Sangromancer
Plague Belcher - Testing says I need more tokens - replaced by Ophiomancer/Spiny Starfish under Token Makers
Diregraf Captain
Massacre Wurm
Dark Prophecy - I just can't seem to manage this card - personal problem - replaced by Corpse Augur

Token Makers
Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder - of course!
Grave Titan
Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
Diregraf Colossus
Cemetery Reaper
Lich Lord of Unx
Noosegraf Mob
The Scarab God
Ophiomancer or Spiny Starfish - Which? Creation of the snake is automatic, but "there can be only one!" (Sorry, Highlander made me do it.) Creation of starfish tokens requires blue, but can be done any number of times, limited by the blue manna available. Could be zero...

Sacrifice Outlets - I formerly had a ton of these in the deck, but Grimgrin seems to be nearly all we need. Thoughts?
Grimgrin, Corpse-Born - listed above...
Attrition
Corpse Harvester
Sidisi, Undead Vizier - usually snags a grave pact effect, or Conspiracy, or other enchantment

Dedicated Blockers/Attack Deterrents
All the grave pact effects from above help here as well.
Will-O'-The-Wisp
Fog of Gnats
Baleful Strix - card draw
Tidehollow Strix
Royal Assassin - Creates unreasonable fear and loathing out of all proportion to his diminutive-ness
Vampire Nighthawk

Ramp, Manna advantage
Darksteel Ingot
Bontu's Monument
Burnished Hart
Solemn Simulacrum I typed "Sad Robot" but it wouldn't work. D'oh!
Crypt Ghast
Black Market
Rooftop Storm - Awesome with Conspiracy or Arcane Adaptation and makes Grimgrin castable for the Cmdr Tax alone!

Card Advantage
Ancestral Vision
Tidings
Indulgent Tormentor
Opportunity

Recursion
Phyrexian Reclamation
Living Death
Havengul Lich
Palace Siege
Champion of stray Souls

Sweepers
Bontu's Last Reckoning
Nevinyrral's Disk
Damnation
Plague Wind
In Garruk's Wake

Utility
Gravecrawler MVP!
Corpse Connoisseur - Gravecrawler finder
Gray Merchant of Asphodel - ridiculously swingey
Conspiracy naming Zombies - because Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder, and Rooftp Storm, and Corpse Harvester!
Arcane Adaptation - See Conspiracy although it won't save Endrek...

Land - 39
16 Swamp
5 Island
1 Underground Sea
1 Watery Grave
1 Sunken Hollow
1 Polluted Delta
1 Drowned Catacomb
1 Choked Estuary
1 Sunken Ruins
1 Tainted Isle
1 Academy Ruins
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Crypt of Agadeem
1 Cabal Coffers
1 Command Tower
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Deserted Temple
1 Unholy Grotto
1 Volrath's Stronghold
1 Westvale Abbey

This is an extremely busy deck. Even with only a couple of the ' Big Synergy' elements in play, a single sacrifice can create the need to go around the circle of players multiple times as the various abilities & triggers go off. FUN!!! Some other possibilities I have toyed with that make this pile even more fun and less win oriented might include cards like Tombstone Stairwell, or Magus of the Abyss. I used to have Mikaeus, the Unhallowed and Triskelion in this deck, but it's just no fun to win that way. The rest of the table would FREAK whenever Big Mike or the Trike hit the table, and the hate would fly. Same for Sheoldred, Whispering One - very effective card, but shrieks and recriminations (and hate) always ensued. The card I find that still seems to create the most unreasonable fear these days is silly old Royal Assassin. He seems to instantly draw whatever removal people have in hand, including sweepers, even when told he is only used for defense - go attack someone else and he won't bother you. Usually. :mrgreen: I have even used him to draw out a sweeper, if I was properly set up to cause everyone else damage and gain a bunch of life. Go figure...

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My youngest son got me addicted to this game - It's all his fault!
Too much is never enough - I'm addicted to MORE!
Reality is for those who can't deal with Middle Earth.
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 Post subject: Re: Grimgrin again + Squirrely Sacrifice Synergy (SSS!)
AgePosted: 2018-Mar-16 12:41 am 

Joined: 2008-May-01 3:07 am
Age: Dragon
Well how about that. Thanks for the shoutout :)

I'm not super familiar with the play style of Grimgrin, but if you want a card that can manage Dark Prophecy, you could consider Dross Harvester. The lifeloss is very manageable and gaining 2 for each creature dying can get out of hand fast with all the grave pacts on board.

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Generals:
Endrek (my main squeeze)
Yeva, Nature's Herald (hold on, I have a response)
Kami of the Crescent Moon (mass draw, bounce and shenanigans)
Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs (you did this to yourself: mono red edition)


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 Post subject: Re: Grimgrin again + Squirrely Sacrifice Synergy (SSS!)
AgePosted: 2018-Mar-18 1:07 pm 
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Joined: 2009-Aug-20 7:49 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: New Hampshire
I would suggest Blue Sun's Zenith over Opportunity - cast for 6 it draws you 1 less card, but it can also be much more flexible than that, and it shuffles in, so you can possibly cast it again.

If you're really all-in on the Gravecrawler plan, Phyrexian Altar is a nice substitute for Rooftop Storm and also a sac outlet.

How about Shadows of the Past? Given how often things are going to be dying, seems like a great card selection engine.

_________________
"The President's job - and if someone sufficiently vain and stupid is picked he won't realize this - is not to wield power, but to draw attention away from it." -- Douglas Adams, The Hitchhiker's Guide tot he Galaxy Radio Transcripts predicting the future.


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 Post subject: Re: Grimgrin again + Squirrely Sacrifice Synergy (SSS!)
AgePosted: 2018-Mar-21 1:46 am 
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Joined: 2011-Jan-02 5:25 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Costa La Haya, capital del ducado Holanda
I have a Glissa deck that tries something similar. Cards from my list to consider:
Skullclamp - I have no clue why you aren't running this besides that you forgot to include it in your list and this list is only 99 cards
Vampiric Rites - brilliant card with some eldrazi spawn around. I put this in for Shadows of the Past, if you have the space for that you should try that as well
Pitiless Plunderer - I want every card that triggers on nontoken creatures dying, and this one gives me mana. Hello Gravecrawler!
Pawn of Ulamog, Sifter of Skulls - see above. Colorless might not be good enough for Gravecrawler, but getting a bunch of spawn and scions isn't that bad. You could even go aggro with them. I run Ogre Slumlord as well, just for the tokens.
Smothering Abomination - draws cards. Sometimes a lot of cards.

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 Post subject: Re: Grimgrin again + Squirrely Sacrifice Synergy (SSS!)
AgePosted: 2018-Mar-26 6:11 am 

Joined: 2010-Apr-16 6:59 am
Age: Drake
Location: Freemont, NE (Omaha area) USA
Thanks for the replies and suggestions! Funny thing is, I have tried most of them at one point or another (except for Blue Sun's Zenith - gotta get me one of those...), but just haven't found the right combination yet. I have made a bunch of other small changes, because I'm like that, so I will simply post the updated list here.

Commander - and primary sac outlet
Grimgrin, Corpse-Born

The Big Synergy in 3 parts:
Pivots - Making everyone else suffers when I sacrifice;
Pain and Suffering for opponents;
Compensation and Benefits for me;

Pivots - the Trifecta plus one
Grave Pact
Butcher of Malakir
Dictate of Erebos
Ruthless Deathfang - Still looking for more even remotely serviceable Grave Pact like effects.

Pain and Suffering and Crowd Control
Fleshbag Marauder
Merciless Executioner
Slum Reaper
Bone Shredder
There are other possibilities - Abyssal Gatekeeper, Shriekmaw, and other creatures with the 'Evoke' ability.

Comp & Benies
Blood Artist
Falkenrath Noble
Zulaport Cutthroat
Sangromancer
Diregraf Captain
Massacre Wurm

Token Makers
Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder - of course!
Grave Titan
Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
Diregraf Colossus
Cemetery Reaper
Lich Lord of Unx
Noosegraf Mob
Spiny Starfish - Ophiomancer THX Superstrength79 !
Overseer of the Damned - seems so big and dumb but works better than expected

Sacrifice Outlets
Grimgrin, Corpse-Born - listed above...
Attrition
Corpse Harvester
Sidisi, Undead Vizier

Dedicated Blockers/Attack Deterrents
All the grave pact effects from above help here also.
Will-O'-The-Wisp
Fog of Gnats
Baleful Strix - Great card!
Tidehollow Strix
Royal Assassin - Creates unreasonable fear and loathing out of all proportion to his narrow little ass.
Vampire Nighthawk - A player I know once said if you are not running this card in any base black deck, you might me making a mistake.

Ramp, Manna advantage
Darksteel Ingot
Bontu's Monument
Burnished Hart
Solemn Simulacrum
Crypt Ghast
Black Market
Rooftop Storm - Awesome with Conspiracy or Arcane Adaptation and makes Grimgrin castable for the Cmdr Tax alone!

Card Advantage
Ancestral Vision
Tidings
Indulgent Tormentor
Opportunity

Recursion
Phyrexian Reclamation
Living Death
Havengul Lich
Palace Siege
Balthor the Defiled or Patriarch's Bidding or ? Suggestions PLEASE!

Sweepers
Bontu's Last Reckoning
Nevinyrral's Disk
Damnation
Plague Wind - Could be replaced by Oblivion Stone because Artifacts/Enchantments!
In Garruk's Wake

Utility
Gravecrawler MVP!
Corpse Connoisseur - Gravecrawler finder
Gray Merchant of Asphodel - ridiculously swingey
Conspiracy naming Zombies - because Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder, and Rooftp Storm, and Corpse Harvester!
Arcane Adaptation - See Conspiracy although it won't save Endrek...
Vengeful Pharaoh - Something else useful for Corpse Connoisseur to dump in the yard.
Wonder - more Corpse Connoisseur fodder - plus flying Zombies - hysterical!

Land - 39
16 Swamp
5 Island
1 Underground Sea
1 Watery Grave
1 Sunken Hollow
1 Polluted Delta
1 Drowned Catacomb
1 Choked Estuary
1 Sunken Ruins
1 Tainted Isle
1 Academy Ruins
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Crypt of Agadeem
1 Cabal Coffers
1 Command Tower
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Deserted Temple
1 Unholy Grotto
1 Volrath's Stronghold
1 Westvale Abbey

Did I make 100 cards that time? I hope so. You guys have me thinking seriously about Skull Clamp, Phyrexian Altar, and especially Blue Sun's Zenith - I love this card's obvious flexibility. I have also been contemplating Jet Medallion, but my only one is in another deck. Oh well - I can always test it with a land and scribbled sticky-note. Study hall proxies forever!

_________________
My youngest son got me addicted to this game - It's all his fault!
Too much is never enough - I'm addicted to MORE!
Reality is for those who can't deal with Middle Earth.
Shoes for Industry!


Last edited by syssc9 on 2018-Apr-04 2:28 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Grimgrin again + Squirrely Sacrifice Synergy (SSS!)
AgePosted: 2018-Mar-28 2:42 pm 
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Joined: 2009-Aug-20 7:49 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: New Hampshire
syssc9 wrote:
Plague Wind - Could be replaced by Oblivion Stone because Artifacts/Enchantments!

If you're thinking about including the stone, you might think about replacing the Disk first. It comes down to a question of how likely you are to actually get an untap step with a disk in play. At the tables I play at, a disk is likely to die in a fire before you can ever activate it, unless you have other shenannigans (untap, protection for your artifacts, etc). The stone, while much more mana intensive, can drop and go off all at once. You can even hold priority and activate it immediately, making it essentially an 8-mana colorless Planar Cleansing. If your opponents routinely let you sit there with 1 mana and a disk in play... well, congrats to you I guess.

EDIT: Also, you might think about swapping one of those 9-mana sweepers for Decree of Pain... wiping the board and drawing a metric buttload of cards is pretty sweet, and it does have the cycling option if you're in a pinch.

_________________
"The President's job - and if someone sufficiently vain and stupid is picked he won't realize this - is not to wield power, but to draw attention away from it." -- Douglas Adams, The Hitchhiker's Guide tot he Galaxy Radio Transcripts predicting the future.


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 Post subject: Re: Grimgrin again + Squirrely Sacrifice Synergy (SSS!)
AgePosted: 2018-Mar-31 2:03 pm 

Joined: 2010-Apr-16 6:59 am
Age: Drake
Location: Freemont, NE (Omaha area) USA
What's that you say? I'm not running Decree of Pain? Well damn! What was I thinking?! I have several I'm not using... Consider it done. Thanks, Sid!

_________________
My youngest son got me addicted to this game - It's all his fault!
Too much is never enough - I'm addicted to MORE!
Reality is for those who can't deal with Middle Earth.
Shoes for Industry!


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 Post subject: Re: Grimgrin again + Squirrely Sacrifice Synergy (SSS!)
AgePosted: 2018-Apr-02 7:18 am 
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Joined: 2010-Dec-13 6:01 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Washington D.C.
Spiny Starfish isn't as good as the snake one. You have to actually have used the regenerate shield on it in order to get the token. You can't just give it a regen shield and get the token.

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 Post subject: Re: Grimgrin again + Squirrely Sacrifice Synergy (SSS!)
AgePosted: 2018-Apr-04 2:16 am 

Joined: 2010-Apr-16 6:59 am
Age: Drake
Location: Freemont, NE (Omaha area) USA
Superstrength79 wrote:
Spiny Starfish isn't as good as the snake one. You have to actually have used the regenerate shield on it in order to get the token. You can't just give it a regen shield and get the token.


Damn! Just looked this up (should have looked it up earlier) and you are right. Ophiomancer FTW!

_________________
My youngest son got me addicted to this game - It's all his fault!
Too much is never enough - I'm addicted to MORE!
Reality is for those who can't deal with Middle Earth.
Shoes for Industry!


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 Post subject: Re: Grimgrin again + Squirrely Sacrifice Synergy (SSS!)
AgePosted: 2018-Apr-17 3:17 am 
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Joined: 2010-Dec-13 6:01 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Washington D.C.
Yeah, I originally read it the - better - way too. Just wanted to let you know, so you can avoid a bad time while playing.

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