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 Post subject: Zedruu the Greathearted
AgePosted: 2012-Oct-08 7:04 am 
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Joined: 2011-Dec-06 5:57 am
Age: Drake
I posted this decklist to link to it from http://mtgcommander.net/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=12371 but feel free to post comments or suggestions!

General: Zedruu the Greathearted

Wild Research package:
Library of Leng
Beacon of Immortality
Spell Crumple
Circular Logic

Gifts:
Gilded Drake
Celestial Dawn
Grid Monitor
Steel Golem
Illusions of Grandeur
Pyromancer's Swath
Statecraft

Protection:
Maze of Ith
Island Sanctuary
Solitary Confinement
Mistmeadow Witch
Cage of Hands
Glacial Chasm
Sphere of Safety
Kor Haven

Wincons:
Sigil of the Empty Throne
Luminarch Ascension
Drogskol Reaver

Mass removal:
Oblivion Stone
Starstorm
Rout
Terminus
Austere Command

Other removal & utility:
Path to Exile
Detention Sphere
Oblation
Aura of Silence
Forbid
Return to Dust
Phyrexian Metamorph
Swords to Plowshares
Tormod's Crypt

Rattlesnakes:
Archon of Justice
Soul Snare
Keiga, the Tide Star

Mana:
Solemn Simulacrum
Land Tax
Darksteel Ingot
Sol Ring
Eternal Dragon
Weathered Wayfarer
Tithe

Tutors & card draw:
Drift of Phantasms
Tolaria West
Flagstones of Trokair
Expedition Map
Academy Rector
Sensei's Divining Top
Cunning Wish
Trinket Mage
Idyllic Tutor
Mystical Tutor
Enlightened Tutor

Recursion:
Mistveil Plains
Sun Titan
Replenish
Academy Ruins
Auramancer
Crucible of Worlds

Walkers:
Tamiyo, the Moon Sage
Ajani Vengeant

Utility lands:
Dust Bowl
High Market
Desolate Lighthouse
Reliquary Tower
Vesuva

Land:
Command Tower
Reflecting Pool
Azorius Chancery
Flood Plain
Flooded Strand
Hallowed Fountain
Tundra
Boros Garrison
Arid Mesa
Sacred Foundry
Plateau
Izzet Boilerworks
Scalding Tarn
Steam Vents
Volcanic Island
Terramorphic Expanse
Evolving Wilds
6 Plains
3 Island
1 Mountain
Temple of the False God

Wishboard: (if the playgroup doesn't allow it then Cunning Wish becomes Hinder)
Into the Core
Wing Shards
Erase
Purify the Grave
Condemn
Hinder
Shattering Pulse
Allay
Argivian Find
Hibernation

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 Post subject: Re: Zedruu the Greathearted
AgePosted: 2012-Oct-08 10:10 am 
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Joined: 2010-Mar-15 2:19 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Denver, CO
I like the deck a lot - some common choices, but also some unusual and interesting ones.

Is this meant for 1v1 or multiplayer? I don't usually find Tamiyo or Ajani V to be very good in multiplayer. They've got scary ultimates that make people attack them, and it's not worth spending a bunch of resources to futilely try and defend them.

Rite of Replication is a good finisher for any deck that expects games to go long.

Armillary Sphere! Hitting land drops is awesome!

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 Post subject: Re: Zedruu the Greathearted
AgePosted: 2012-Oct-08 9:43 pm 
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Joined: 2011-Dec-06 5:57 am
Age: Drake
To be honest, Ajani was kinda thrown in and doesn't fit the deck. He has absolutely no synergy with the rest of the deck. I think I put him in because it's the only deck I have where he fits color wise. He should be Guard Gomazoa or something similar.

Tamiyo's ultimate on the other hand has synergies and quite a few card choices in the deck are there to protect her when she's out. I really want to make her work so I'll futily try to protect her a little while longer ;-)

The deck indeed needs it's land drops and your suggestion of Oath of Lieges in the other thread seems very interesting!

I've considered Rite of Replication and I intentionally didn't include it because a lack of synergy with the rest of the deck. It was one of the last cards that got cut.

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 Post subject: Re: Zedruu the Greathearted
AgePosted: 2012-Oct-09 2:24 am 
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Joined: 2010-Mar-15 2:19 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Denver, CO
Oath of Lieges is quite possibly my favorite card in my Zedruu deck, but mine is a very different build from yours. My Zedruu deck is an intentionally-bad politics/semi-hug deck designed to propel things quickly into a late game where it can flourish. Oath is great in my build because it ramps me up while buying goodwill by giving people resources I will eventually use against them. As icing on the cake, I can give it away without changing anything.

It could be good in your deck as a way to maintain mana parity with the ramp decks, but be aware that it will usually be help your opponents quite a bit, too.

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 Post subject: Re: Zedruu the Greathearted
AgePosted: 2012-Oct-09 2:43 am 
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Joined: 2010-Mar-03 10:07 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Hmmm... There's a lot of fun stuff in this deck, but some of it is... how shall I put it... Not Good. (Sorry.) Some of your questionable includes, along with thoughts on how you could replace them/make them work:

-Celestial Dawn: So, I lied-- this card is *good*, but it is not *fun*. Nobody likes to be Contamination-locked, and because you haven't actually killed anyone, when the inevitable sweeper hits and your Bleach goes away you are going to have an especially pissed opponent on your hands. Taniwha does much the same thing but is more "fair" because every other turn they get their lands back. Plus, they have a 7/7 monster (though putting Arrest on it is pretty funny).
-Grid Monitor and Steel Golem: Less relevant than you might think. If your meta is especially creature heavy it might work, but otherwise you're saddled with vanilla creatures who you can't cast unless your general is already on the field.
-Cage of Hands: One of the best things to donate in this deck is removal enchantments. This one is... not as good to donate as some of the other ones, for obvious reasons. Oblivion Ring or Arrest might work better for you.
-Starstorm: Soooo expensive, especially if your opponents have fatties on board that you need to kill. Chain Reaction or Blasphemous Act will usually wipe the board in red for much cheaper. Of course, you're playing white, so you don't strictly need Red creature sweepers-- Akroma's Vengeance or Supreme Verdict might be better for you.
Auramancer: Really very weak-- you can do a lot better. Put another Win Con in this slot, such as Insurrection or Storm Herd-- you will need them in this deck, since you *probably* won't get there on your regular creature damage.

I was going to complain about Aura of Silence and Soul Snare, but then I saw that you're running Sun Titan and those cards became OK. Still not terribly strong, but if you're getting value out of them they're fine.

Good luck with the deck! See also my Zedruu list (linked in sig) for some additional pillowfort ideas.

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Currently Playing:
Animar: All-Creatures, All The Time (Silly stompy-aggro)
Sen Triplets: Robots! (Proliferate Control/Combo)
Sedris, the Traitor King: BRAAAAAINS (Zombie Tribal)
Zedruu, Group Pickpocket (Pillowfort Test of Endurance deck. You heard right)
Ghave, Guru of Dumb (Token Control)

gaijinguy wrote:
As for blue- being boring/infuriating by crushing everyone else's fun until it assembles a cheeseball combo is pretty much what it DOES.


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 Post subject: Re: Zedruu the Greathearted
AgePosted: 2012-Oct-09 3:41 am 
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Joined: 2006-May-18 5:21 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
One of the best pieces of mana fixing I have found is Endless Horizons. It comes into play, gives you a few land, and then becomes worthless, which is the ideal kind of thing for Zedruu.


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 Post subject: Re: Zedruu the Greathearted
AgePosted: 2012-Oct-09 3:58 am 
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Joined: 2010-Mar-15 2:19 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Denver, CO
herodotusjr wrote:
-Celestial Dawn: So, I lied-- this card is *good*, but it is not *fun*. Nobody likes to be Contamination-locked, and because you haven't actually killed anyone, when the inevitable sweeper hits and your Bleach goes away you are going to have an especially pissed opponent on your hands. Taniwha does much the same thing but is more "fair" because every other turn they get their lands back. Plus, they have a 7/7 monster (though putting Arrest on it is pretty funny).
-Grid Monitor and Steel Golem: Less relevant than you might think. If your meta is especially creature heavy it might work, but otherwise you're saddled with vanilla creatures who you can't cast unless your general is already on the field.

I don't like the lockout card either, but it seems like this deck is built to use Zedruu as a lock-donate more than an incremental card advantage engine. I try to give advice that helps people build their deck, not advice that helps them build my deck.

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 Post subject: Re: Zedruu the Greathearted
AgePosted: 2012-Oct-09 9:55 pm 
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Joined: 2011-Dec-06 5:57 am
Age: Drake
You're probably right about Celestial Dawn & the Steel Golems. The deck used to have Test of Endurance as a quick win con after donating Celestial Dawn to the strongest opponent not playing white (I try not to let an opponent sit idlely for more than 2 turns.) The Golems are clunky indeed, you need to keep Zedruu alive for a turn or have 11-12 mana that can easily make UWR twice. They might get the hammer soon as I'm getting great suggestions in this thread.

herodotusjr wrote:
-Cage of Hands: One of the best things to donate in this deck is removal enchantments. This one is... not as good to donate as some of the other ones, for obvious reasons. Oblivion Ring or Arrest might work better for you.
-Starstorm: Soooo expensive, especially if your opponents have fatties on board that you need to kill. Chain Reaction or Blasphemous Act will usually wipe the board in red for much cheaper. Of course, you're playing white, so you don't strictly need Red creature sweepers-- Akroma's Vengeance or Supreme Verdict might be better for you.
Auramancer: Really very weak-- you can do a lot better. Put another Win Con in this slot, such as Insurrection or Storm Herd-- you will need them in this deck, since you *probably* won't get there on your regular creature damage.

I was going to complain about Aura of Silence and Soul Snare, but then I saw that you're running Sun Titan and those cards became OK. Still not terribly strong, but if you're getting value out of them they're fine.


Auramancer got cut for Armillary Sphere yesterday ;) Cage of Hands is in the deck because of Sigil of the Empty Throne, I've also thought about Gossamer Chains as an extra source of angels. Oblivion Stone got switched for Detention Sphere last week, although I was a bit reluctant. I probably need to cut something else to make room for O-Stone. I chose Starstorm because of Wild Research, same goes for Soul Snare and Aura of Silence. Not to mention the synergy with Sigil of the Empty Throne.

I haven't played the deck much since I cut Test of Endurance so I might indeed need some extra win conditions.

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 Post subject: Re: Zedruu the Greathearted
AgePosted: 2012-Nov-13 12:14 am 
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Joined: 2008-Dec-04 9:12 am
Age: Wyvern
Is there a reason you run so little Commander protection?

Also, from the fun vs useful angle, I know many disagree but in a casual setting, the Vow cycle has always proven awesome. If you throw it on a Taniwha you donated, even better, that propels the End Game in your favor.

With Island Sanctuary, if so desired I put Mystic Decree in and out of my deck based on tweeks.

I often find creatures that switch roles seem to draw less fire than donating global effects that are clearly there to be donated. IE Rogue Skycaptain.

All of this is contingent on how you present yourself. I found the enclosed wisdom of the booklet humorous yet true "Your best weapon is your mouth". If you actually cause chaos but in only minor angles, then things like Insurrection, Reins of Power or Blatant Thiever can be a snuck in finisher.

I am less a fan of prison as it tends to lead your repeat use of the deck to a groaning/flaming failure.


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 Post subject: Re: Zedruu the Greathearted
AgePosted: 2013-Apr-02 3:11 pm 

Joined: 2012-Feb-17 12:31 am
Age: Drake
perhaps Absolute Grace as it usually has a good chance of being usefull. could also run Glamerdye just for fun or to switch what protection Absolute Grace gives. Rainbow Vale is a fun land to use. Transcendence can keep you alive if your life is low or can be used to kill. Reins of Power can allow for nice defense or offense. and if used with Day of the Dragons can provide you with an army and will give you the creatures you borrowed back if the Day is removed later.


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 Post subject: Re: Zedruu the Greathearted
AgePosted: 2013-Apr-08 1:31 am 

Joined: 2008-Aug-04 9:41 am
Age: Dragon
I would cut the Grid Monitor. When you donate it you have an angry person now equipped with a 4/6 beatstick. A Steel Golem however, you can block indefinitely with Zedruu being a sweet 2/4.
Celestial Dawn is also pretty good as mana fixing, making sure you can cast Kiki-Jikis, Dominus of Fealty, Cryptic Command, etc etc.

I do agree with some of the earlier posters though, a Storm Herd or something wouldn't ...herd (trolol) your deck. I also like small cards like Vedalkan Plotter and Political Trickery. Switch some basic lands for some sweet bounce lands. Get that Mishra's Workshop!.
Best turn with my zedruu deck was casting Copy Enchantment on a Mana Reflection, powering out a Gilded Lotus, laying down a Mystic Gate, using a bazillion mana to cast a Jace, the Mind Sculptor, brainstormed, Drew Plotter, Put Stroke of Genius back on top, cast Plotter trading my plains for a Gaea's Cradle (which he tapped in response :evil: ) and then casting Storm Herd. Your move.
I brought the wrath of the table down on me with that turn :)

Btw, where is your Parallax Haze?


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